Free Trojan Phaser for the CPCPlus

[dragon]

Well, i supposed that being spanish, you were talking about gunstick, jejeje.

Jajaja, you don't read my post in amstrad.es? well, that's why in first time i buy the magnum to transform it to the gx4000 using the deepfb tutorial. But later, i read about operation wolf  and now i feel sorry for breaking the gun.

So I'am not sure about search another to the plus(and more later a gustick jeje). Or if other gun (as the sinclair for example, can be transformed to the cpc+).

At the same time i thinking, my ctm 644 is to "small" to play the games.And I remember the usb development and the ps2 lcd pistols guns and i ask here.

The Magnum and Trojan (more common in UK) using the hardware check (CRTC LPEN input) and the Gunstick and West Phaser (more common in Spain and France) using a software method (polling the gun sensor pins and counting cycles to know when the blank was hitted). I´m talking of the last ones.

Sorry, but i buy a non common gun jejejeje. I buy a french Magnum, and is a very rare magnum(maybe), because it comes with a different tape, an amstrad tape with the games, not the tape that appears in cpc power from mastertronic.



Anyway. Using the joystick port is best, because it can works in all computers and the gx4000 without modification.

[SyX]

Jajaja, you don't read my post in amstrad.es?

No, sorry, i was hoping somebody answered in the NTSC thread, before to check the new posts in the forum, because those days there is so little activity there.

well, that's why in first time i buy the magnum to transform it to the gx4000 using the deepfb tutorial. But later, i read about operation wolf  and now i feel sorry for breaking the gun.

So I'am not sure about search another to the plus(and more later a gustick jeje). Or if other gun (as the sinclair for example, can be transformed to the cpc+).

Don´t break the cpc gun, the sinclair gun (+2A, +3) should be very easy to convert to CPC, and it´s always more easy to get the CPC+ connector than the CPC bus expansion. And more reason if you think is something rare

Anyway. Using the joystick port is best, because it can works in all computers and the gx4000 without modification.

Technical way, the other guns have more accuracy and are more CPC friendly, but need different connectors and code for support CPC and CPC+, while the joyports no.

[dragon]

Don´t break the cpc gun, the sinclair gun (+2A, +3) should be very easy to convert to CPC, and it´s always more easy to get

sinclair gun? so this magnum is not valid?.

Sinclair ZX Spectrum Magnum GUN Controller Tested Trusted Ebay Shop | eBay

PD:who is the +2+3 sinclair gun?. I not have a spectrum.

[SyX]

Amstrad relabeled the Magnum/Trojan light guns for using in a few game packs that came with the CPC and the ZX Spectrum +2A/+3 (the zx spectrum computers made by Amstrad).



As you can see is identical to the Magnum. And convert them to CPC+ machines should be easy and painless, but those guns are so cheap than they look

PS: In reality any kind of light gun system (until snes/megadrive era) can be converted to CPC without too much difficulties.

[Bryce]

But there is two kind of guns for CPC.

The Magnum and Trojan (more common in UK) using the hardware check (CRTC LPEN input) and the Gunstick and West Phaser (more common in Spain and France) using a software method (polling the gun sensor pins and counting cycles to know when the blank was hitted). I´m talking of the last ones.

The first type is connected to the expansion bus or in the CPC+ to the AUX connector and the second ones are connected to the joystick port.

With respect to the number of games, we have a similar quantity for both methods.

For the Magnum/Trojan, there are the next games:
Operation Wolf, Bullseye, Missile Ground Zero, Robot Attack, Rookie, Solar Invasion, American Turbo-King, Billy the Kid, Bronx Street Cop, F-16 Fighting Falcon and Jungle Warfare.

For the Trojan CPC+: Enforcer and Skeet Shoot.

For the Gunstick:
Target +, Mike Gunner, Bestial Warrior, Solo, Space Smugglers, Guillermo Tell, Trigger and The A Team.

For the West Phaser:
Westphaser/Steve McQueen.
Well, i supposed that being spanish, you were talking about gunstick, jejeje.

The second type would be the easiest to emulate, even with a USB lightgun, but it would have to be one of the older lightguns that only worked on CRT, not the new ones with IR strips and it would still only work on CRTs. In fact it should be possible to add this functionality to the AMX Mouse adapter firmware.

Bryce.

[TotO]

Just build a CPC to SMS joystick adapter to invert pin7/pin9 and add a +5V jack on it to manage pin5.
Then, you can plug the ZX Lightgun w/o any hack as well as SEGA Master System controllers. (and more)

The "CTC-AY" board provide 4 pins to handle the other method using the Lightpen signal.
In a same way, a simple adapter should allow to plug the Lightgun.

Spoiler: ShowHide

[attachimg=1]

[Bryce]

True, but USB lightguns are much easier to find than ZX lightguns.

Bryce.

[dragon]

Amstrad relabeled the Magnum/Trojan light guns for using in a few game packs that came with the CPC and the ZX Spectrum +2A/+3 (the zx spectrum computers made by Amstrad).



As you can see is identical to the Magnum. And convert them to CPC+ machines should be easy and painless, but those guns are so cheap than they look

PS: In reality any kind of light gun system (until snes/megadrive era) can be converted to CPC without too much difficulties.

So there are two types of spectrum magnum?. The magnun i Post with screws and the cheap amstrad without screws?. The ebay magnum,appears to have the +3 connector¿?., so maybe y buy these first and try  it. Anyway I found the sinclair in  dataserve and it only cost 9,20e(shipping include). So in the worst case I can take the case "good" with screws, and rehuse it in the sinclair. Because I guess that has no screws are shatter when opened.

edit: I am not sure if modify the light gun is posible. The spectrum aux port is:
1   GND
2   OUTPUT BIT 0
3   INPUT BIT 4
4   OUTPUT BIT 1
5   INPUT BIT 5
6   +12V

And the amstrad is:

1  +5V
2  /Joystick1
3  Light Pen (Trojan Light Phazer: Light sensor)
4  /Fire 2   (Trojan Light Phazer: Trigger button)
5  /Fire 1   (Trojan Light Phazer: Not used) (could be menu/mode button)
6  Ground

If I understand correctly, amstrad trojan uses pin 1,2,3,5 and 6.

I  not found information about the pins used in sinclair magnum. Except this: Google Groups

So pin 5=pin4? and pin 4=pin 3??. pin 1=pin 6?, vcc pin 12v vs 5v? uf. And what about pin 2 in asmtrad?.

[SyX]

So there are two types of spectrum magnum?. The magnun i Post with screws and the cheap amstrad without screws?. The ebay magnum,appears to have the +3 connector¿?., so maybe y buy these first and try  it. Anyway I found the sinclair in  dataserve and it only cost 9,20e(shipping include). So in the worst case I can take the case "good" with screws, and rehuse it in the sinclair. Because I guess that has no screws are shatter when opened.

There is not two types, internally they are the same and the only difference is the use of screws and the sinclair/amstrad/magnum logo.

edit: I am not sure if modify the light gun is posible.

It´s possible, you only need to take your time studying both guns and both machines, and you will need to make tests to understand them. Those things happen when you want to do something that other people has not made or not published how to make it and that means work in it

For example, i haven´t a CPC+ Magnum/Trojan gun (only a gunstick, west phaser and a normal CPC magnum) but i'm sure is using 1,3,4 and 6. If that schematic is correct, and that is a big if, pin 2 only would be used with a two guns adaptor and in a two player simultaneously game, but there is not those in CPC+. The same way with the other fire button in the pin 5, the only CPC+ gun use only one fire button and that is pin 4.

[TFM]

The "CTC-AY" board provide 4 pins to handle the other method using the Lightpen signal.
In a same way, a simple adapter should allow to plug the Lightgun.

WoW! Would be good to have more information about that. Any link?[nb]Sorry, I know I'm way to nosy and bug you all day long.[/nb]

[TotO]

You got a picture into the spoiler.
The idea was to simply provide the pins needed to handle a Light Pen or a Light Gun on most CPC games:
TRigger, Light Sensor, Vcc, Gnd

Then, you are free to make an adapter to plug your existing gun to it.
I should provide if a model/connector is really common. (I don't know all)

[dragon]

There is not two types, internally they are the same and the only difference is the use of screws and the sinclair/amstrad/magnum logo.
It´s possible, you only need to take your time studying both guns and both machines, and you will need to make tests to understand them. Those things happen when you want to do something that other people has not made or not published how to make it and that means work in it

For example, i haven´t a CPC+ Magnum/Trojan gun (only a gunstick, west phaser and a normal CPC magnum) but i'm sure is using 1,3,4 and 6. If that schematic is correct, and that is a big if, pin 2 only would be used with a two guns adaptor and in a two player simultaneously game, but there is not those in CPC+. The same way with the other fire button in the pin 5, the only CPC+ gun use only one fire button and that is pin 4.

Yeah, I take a look to the spectrum +3 service manual. the first problem is the vcc. Probably it only uses 3,5,6,a 1 pin. As the 3,5 are connected to tristate buffer. The gun send is the spectrum recieve, when not are in indempedanze state.

Probably it need an hardware modification in gun to work with the cpc. As the cpc only provide 5v.Depend how the gun uses de 12v,Maybe with lucky he down the vcc to 5v inside the gun .

Anyway the first is open the gun and made a route of the pistes and component, it no appear to big .

[Gryzor]

Oh, so basically a micro switch and... a shitload of glue?

[TotO]

So technologies!
And you don't see all the electronic inside the black box expansion connector... 

Spoiler: ShowHide

[MacDeath]

Is this easy to put those Phone like connectors ? could be fun to get lightpens using it... for GX4000 and PLUS' alike...

[dragon]

Is this easy to put those Phone like connectors ? could be fun to get lightpens using it... for GX4000 and PLUS' alike...

Yes is easy. these are the material needed:

HQ TEL-0093 - Pinzas para engastar cables: VALUELINE: Amazon.es: Electrónica + MOLEX - 90075-0031 - MODULAR, PLUG, IDC, RJ11, 6P6C | eBay + CABLE TELEFONICO PLANO FLEXIBLE 6 HILOS ROLLO CARRETE TELEFONO 100M NEGRO BD4335 (well not 100m jaja)


como hacer un cable de red paso a paso crimpado o ponchado - YouTube sorry is in spanish, but yo can see it easy, the crimper to buy is rj-11, 6 contacts , the links are only expample of the orientarive prices .

Oh, so basically a micro switch and... a shitload of glue?

Probably will be something like this:


This is the schematic of sega master system gun.

[Bryce]

The glue-laden circuit above is much simpler than Sega circuit. The two transistors on the right are most likely a cheap two stage amp and the third transistor is a TTL level switch.

Bryce.

[dragon]

That is the only picture i found about amstrad magnum. the upper is from spectrum gun. It only have one condenser.

[TotO]

Is-it possible to have an unburied picture?

[MacDeath]

I have a spare sega SMS lightphaser... got to convert it... parhaps I may find my old lightpen somewhere, not sure...

[TotO]

I have a spare sega SMS lightphaser... got to convert it... parhaps I may find my old lightpen somewhere, not sure...

Build a DB9 adapter to not destroy it. 

[dragon]

Is-it possible to have an unburied picture?

I think nobody search dismount a gun that you can`t mount , but can be very good obtain a better picture and the schematic :s

I can ask in amstrad.es

One cuestion. ¿The magnum is compatible with all cpcs?. I found a french article about the crtc differences, and  the amstrad solution to use  varius crtc with the cpc, means the only cpcs  can read the register 16 and 17 are the equipped with the crtc 0.

[dragon]

O.k, so mi spectrum gun arrives.(the amstrad gun is lost wtf.)

With multimeter: pin 6 ->are connect to orange blue and green(green  by the motherboard probably)(+12v vcc?).
                         pin 5 ->red cable(trigger out -> triger are connected to  blue wire ). (0 trigger preset 1 not preset)
                         pin 4 ->not connected.
                         pin 3->connect to green, blue, orange(blue,and orange by the motherboard probably).(1 if screen refresh).
                         pin 2->connect to nothing.
                         pin 1->black wire ground.


                         








atachements are the original pictures. Sorry, I only have 32kbp upload, upload a picture take  me much time.

[Bryce]

Although we all appreciate large clear photos... I can the resistor values on these pictures from the carpark!! Any chance you could replace the pictures with sensibly sized pictures?

Bryce.

[dragon]

Yeah bryce I I'm on it.