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Gate array decapped!

Started by robcfg, 16:54, 12 April 16

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dragon

Quote from: TotO on 22:34, 28 April 16
I have only one 40010 37AA (Made in Italy) chip.  :-\

Its a strange species, in extintiction with the 40008.

robcfg

Hello everyone!


Sean sent me a first picture of the 40489 ASIC. It's not useful for getting anything out of it, but it's a first step  8)


The whole thing is covered by a brown plastic layer that Sean hopes will get away with nitric acid.


This one took 576 pictures...  :o


He will be taking 20x pictures soon.

dragon

Thanks robcfg, so the  black hole are plastic?.

The chip appears divided in some parts, i think one of the type zones can be the asic ram. I not sure if it is a gate array or a asic. Anyway it not appear to have  name constructor on it

In service manual have note it have 10000 logic gates. Is 10x more that the gate array.

In the other hand can be more zoom in the future to the preasic too?.

robcfg

Actually, the plastic is the brown square that cover almost everything.


Also, yes, several parts can be seen. I bet that the 16 identical areas are the sprites' ram.


Sean told me he'll be taking higher resolution pictures, but keep in mind that he has to take thousands of pictures, and then compose them together so be patient  ;)

dragon

#104
O.k robcfg, i think tha name chip is in a corner, but is to little to see it. With lucky we can view it at 16x later :) . Or simply tell sean take note of the code.

The chip appeared very well structurated.Steve gane made a good job.k

as you say, the chip have 16 squares 8 in upper and 8 in down part.+ 1 extra maybe to control it 1square=1sprite?

Or best, the two extra squares are connected to  the outside directly. Maybe is another thing as the dma sound part or so.

ah, i don't see it in the movil XD, but i can view it in pc the ic code is "c838002"

gerald

Quote from: robcfg on 11:38, 04 May 16
Hello everyone!


Sean sent me a first picture of the 40489 ASIC. It's not useful for getting anything out of it, but it's a first step  8)


The whole thing is covered by a brown plastic layer that Sean hopes will get away with nitric acid.


This one took 576 pictures...  :o


He will be taking 20x pictures soon.
Higher resolution is definitively needed if we want to get something out of it  ;)

TFM

Quote from: robcfg on 11:38, 04 May 16
Sean sent me a first picture of the 40489 ASIC. It's not useful for getting anything out of it, but it's a first step  8)


One can clearly see the sprite RAM, tooks lots of space...
TFM of FutureSoft
Also visit the CPC and Plus users favorite OS: FutureOS - The Revolution on CPC6128 and 6128Plus

dragon

who is using more space for 8 sprites commodore ic or amstrad?.

Commodore 8565 VIC-II



arnoldemu

Quote from: dragon on 20:15, 04 May 16
who is using more space for 8 sprites commodore ic or amstrad?.

Commodore 8565 VIC-II
commodore reads sprites from ram so no sprite data on the ic.

asic has sprites on the ic. So amstrad uses much more!
My games. My Games
My website with coding examples: Unofficial Amstrad WWW Resource

TFM

So for the ASIC II...
- 256 sprite colors instead of 16
- 32 sprites instead of 16


Just in case there will be a 7128 Plus or something like that.  ;)
TFM of FutureSoft
Also visit the CPC and Plus users favorite OS: FutureOS - The Revolution on CPC6128 and 6128Plus

dragon

I think i more probable a gate array plus.

Because the gate array is in soket so is cuestion of swap. In the rest you need unsolder/solder...

You can made a gate array with plus features.

||C|-|E||

#111
The Plus ASIC looks really pretty and well organized. I must confess that I was not expecting something like that, so simmetric. Actually, I was almost sure that it would be a much less organized design, where you could clearly see the CPU in a corner, some memory somewhere else, a section for the Plus features... much more like the PS4 APU .

robcfg

I'd like to thank @Higgy because the 37AA 40010 chip just arrived and will be on the next batch for decapping.


It will be nice to see if they have any difference.


So, thank you very much!  8)

Higgy

No problem. Glad the timing worked out and I saw it would be useful. Otherwise it would have probably ended up in the bin  :doh:

Retro communities are a nice friendly bunch  so if I can help I like to.
It is also fun reading and learning about new systems. Next job is to add a reset switch and remove my Type 2 CRTC  :o

arnoldemu

Quote from: Higgy on 14:51, 05 May 16
No problem. Glad the timing worked out and I saw it would be useful. Otherwise it would have probably ended up in the bin  :doh:

Retro communities are a nice friendly bunch  so if I can help I like to.
It is also fun reading and learning about new systems. Next job is to add a reset switch and remove my Type 2 CRTC  :o
send the type 2 for decapping! :)
My games. My Games
My website with coding examples: Unofficial Amstrad WWW Resource

dragon

#115
Quote from: arnoldemu link=topic=11888.msg125934#msg125934 dcpce=1462522241
send the type 2 for decapping! :)

I quote you to read you

(Expansion quote you know lol).

I can donate a broken cartridge board with a broken acid, it dies time ago in the process of transform it to a socket cartridge when c4cpc not exist. Probably it burn lol.Anyway the board have damaged too.

What other  chips have unkown die . pcw and  last spectrum anstrad made?. I think the autor of zx spectrum book not decapped it, it stop in amstrad.

Munchausen

Quote from: ||C|-|E|| on 11:00, 05 May 16
The Plus ASIC looks really pretty and well organized. I must confess that I was not expecting something like that, so simmetric. Actually, I was almost sure that it would be a much less organized design, where you could clearly see the CPU in a corner, some memory somewhere else, a section for the Plus features... much more like the PS4 APU .

The CPU and RAM are actually still separate with the ASIC. I didn't actually realise that the sprite RAM was on board, I'd guess that might have been quite expensive. I wonder if that was just the cheapest way to do it while maintaining backwards compatibility (not changing the CPU timing by further RAM accesses from the "gate array", and not needing extra external RAM).

The developments in this thread are very exciting, it's always the first thread I check back to at the moment!

TotO

Is really useful to send CRTC for decaping?
They are not CPC special circuits.
"You make one mistake in your life and the internet will never let you live it down" (Keith Goodyer)

||C|-|E||

Quote from: Munchausen on 20:18, 06 May 16
The CPU and RAM are actually still separate with the ASIC. I didn't actually realise that the sprite RAM was on board, I'd guess that might have been quite expensive. I wonder if that was just the cheapest way to do it while maintaining backwards compatibility (not changing the CPU timing by further RAM accesses from the "gate array", and not needing extra external RAM).

The developments in this thread are very exciting, it's always the first thread I check back to at the moment!

Thank you! I knew that the RAM and the Z80 were outside, but I was still expecting to see something like a "general" CPU inside among the other chips, stupid of me  :-\

dragon

I read in the google groups time ago, the dma in asic is a little processor from people of amstrad. Thats because i tell if the two big square in the left near the other 8 sprites are the dma sound.

So maybe is true the asic have a cpu in some form :).

gerald

Quote from: TotO on 20:43, 06 May 16
Is really useful to send CRTC for decaping?
They are not CPC special circuits.
Not CPC specific, but different behaviour of different version when used on CPC.
Could still be interesting to have all type reverse engineered at some point.

TotO

Sure, while the guy is OK to do it for all the IC sent.  :)
"You make one mistake in your life and the internet will never let you live it down" (Keith Goodyer)

dragon

Fortunly we live in a epoque when you can made 500 pictures at not cost.


Inagine decapped the asic in the 80 with analogue photography.


Hi man of kodak shop i need send to reveal 500 pictures of a chip lol. (A dolar apear in eyes of man).

Munchausen

Quote from: ||C|-|E|| on 21:43, 06 May 16
Thank you! I knew that the RAM and the Z80 were outside, but I was still expecting to see something like a "general" CPU inside among the other chips, stupid of me  :-\

Actually you may be right, it does have to do something like decode register -> do something, with RAM access etc too, so it may somewhat resemble a CPU.

dragon

Just for curiosity any news obtaining the 40010 schematic or the other ics?

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