GX4000 Multicart/SD card

[chinnyhill10]

Seems odd that, as far as I can see, nobody to date has produced a GX4000 multicast that could access images from an SD card.


So what gives? Isn't it possible or is the market too small?

[CraigsBar]

I'd buy 3 tomorrow if it were available. One for each of my plusses.

[chinnyhill10]

I'd buy 3 tomorrow if it were available. One for each of my plusses.

Both my Atari 8 bit and my C64 have mass storage in their cartridge slots. The only thing I can think of is either the Plus/GX4000 market is too small or the implementation of the cartridge ports are different.

[mr_lou]

This is the 4th or 5th time someone brings this up.

Please do a search to find out all the reasons why it hasn't been done yet. It has been answered many times.

[CraigsBar]

Cart shells, acids and the availability of an os to select the cart image on itself. we know. It'd still be good tho. Especially since with a x-mem you can boot a plus to basic even with a game cart in the slot. When my 464 plus comes back from Bryce I think I'll put my acid inside board in it, and see if that will boot from the xmem with no cart.

[chinnyhill10]

This is the 4th or 5th time someone brings this up.

Please do a search to find out all the reasons why it hasn't been done yet. It has been answered many times.

If we put a ban on discussing old things we may as well have the forum closed down!

[chinnyhill10]

If we put a ban on discussing old things we may as well have the forum closed down!

Cart shells aren't a problem for other systems. They simply get new ones made.


Surely the ACID chip could be emulated as part of an FPGA that holds the carts firmware.


Certainly the 1541 Ultimate for the C64 and the Side2 for the Atari are basically computing devices in their own right that simply feed the 8 bit machines with the data they require.

[mr_lou]

If we put a ban on discussing old things we may as well have the forum closed down!

It's not old. It's quite recent.
And the search button is there for a reason: To not have people repeat themselves answering the same question over and over again. 

[Bryce]

Seems odd that, as far as I can see, nobody to date has produced a GX4000 multicast that could access images from an SD card.


So what gives? Isn't it possible or is the market too small?

The problem isn't the market, more the available software. There's less than 30 titles available on cartridge, so an SD card is total overkill, they'd fit on a simple EPROM with some DIP switches.

Bryce.

[Novabug]

Honestly, If I had the spare money and equipment, I'd develop one in a heartbeat. However, without the ROM for Chase HQ2, it would be incomplete.

[chinnyhill10]

Honestly, If I had the spare money and equipment, I'd develop one in a heartbeat. However, without the ROM for Chase HQ2, it would be incomplete.

The C64 and Atari don't have that many cartridge titles but their solutions not only let you load carts, but any software you like.


OK a device like the 1541 Ultimate is high end and expensive, but it will load everything you throw at it. Disk images, tape images and all from the cartridge slot.

[steve]

It's not old. It's quite recent.
And the search button is there for a reason: To not have people repeat themselves answering the same question over and over again. 

I don't see a problem, it promotes the idea that this is a friendly and helpful site, if it really is a problem then a FAQ stickied thread could hold the answers to those questions, then again maybe all frequently asked questions need their own wiki pages.

[MacDeath]

vicious circle debate...
No Hardware = no one to develop Software for this.
No software = no one to develop the hardware.

To arrange production for casing and perhaps 500-1000 empty cartriges first batch would need a few thouzand euros in advance and no one kickstarted this yet..

issue is that when we talk about it, some want a Man in the Middle solution so you need only one ACID chip, other want an emulated ACID on each cartridge, other want the cartridge to be actually a developper kit with easy possibility to burn the ROM directly from the cartridge slot (which is impossible lol), others want a 4x128K compilation model and other want a 512K model. Some suggest EEPROM others suggest FlashROM. some want a simple classic cartridge while other want it to be an SD card reader.
And people are never never never aggreeing on the colur for the casing.

and yep, every 6 month someone new start this exact same thread, but this is not a problem to me.

[mr_lou]

I see the debate is repeating itself.

Here are some links where you can read ahead then, and see what questions will be asked and what the reply will be.

"Everdrive" cartridge for GX4000
Idea! A CPC+/GX4000 Cartridge Emulator?
Existing games => Cartridges
New Plus Series Game a Proposal
CPC cartridges possible to make new ones or not worthwhile?

I brought it up myself previously because I'd love to see a multicartridge for my CPC+
So much that I'm willing to donate at least 100 euro to the project.
But the experts have spoken (many times), and it doesn't seem to be happening.

What I suggested last time is this: Everyone agree on what the best option is. Then start a fundrazr or kickstarter or whatever, and then just get started.
But there are many issues not yet resolved, e.g. about creating the cases. 3d printing vs molding. Lots of opinions about what is best. And we're not getting anywhere closer to an agreement.

Personally, I'd love a cartridge like the Everdrive, that takes an SD card. That opens up for more potential CPC+ developers too, since it'll be easy to test their CPC+/GX4000 games on the real device. And I'd love to see new cartridge games for my CPC+, that uses much more of the CPC+ features.

But everyone is right about what they say: The current amount of games just isn't worth making such a multicartridge for. The creation of plastic cases is crazy expensive. ACID ship expensive to emulate. Everything is possible, but requires money, moeny and time and money and time.

Let's put it another way: Let's see the money first. Someone (that we agree should do it) should create this fundrazr, or simply just receive donations via paypal, and then we'll see where we stand.

Get it started already! 

[MacDeath]

i already see a crook going out with our money and no cartridges done...


Shut up and take my money !!!

[mr_lou]

i already see a crook going out with our money and no cartridges done...

I doubt we'll ever reach the fundraiser stage.
As you say yourself, we'll never ever agree on which way to go.
I don't see it ever happening.
All we'll see are new threads every now and then, people asking all over why we don't have it yet.

If you're not prepared to donate at least 100 euro to this project, then you're not interested enough, and then it will never happen. Talk all you will. Won't produce any cartridges. 

[Bryce]

The C64 and Atari don't have that many cartridge titles but their solutions not only let you load carts, but any software you like.


OK a device like the 1541 Ultimate is high end and expensive, but it will load everything you throw at it. Disk images, tape images and all from the cartridge slot.

The C64 had over 300 software cartridges, the Atari 8-bit series had around 150, the CPC had 26.

Bryce.

[arnoldemu]

The C64 had over 300 software cartridges, the Atari 8-bit series had around 150, the CPC had 26.

Bryce.

Are you including the homebrew carts and my conversions?

Which includes:

Blue Angel 69
Stryker and the Crypts of Trojan.

It would take me a while to get to 300!

[mr_lou]

Are you including the homebrew carts and my conversions?
It would take me a while to get to 300!

...but you can do it!

We're depending on you! 

[CraigsBar]

Are you including the homebrew carts and my conversions?

Which includes:

Blue Angel 69
Stryker and the Crypts of Trojan.

It would take me a while to get to 300!

you converted Stryker to cart? Is it gx4000 friendly? Did you add any thing extra or just port from the dsk?

Craig

[arnoldemu]

you converted Stryker to cart? Is it gx4000 friendly? Did you add any thing extra or just port from the dsk?

Craig

Yes I did either earlier this year or a year ago.

Yes it's gx4000 friendly.

I took the disk version and converted it to cart using my filesystem. I used the disk version but I did modify it.

Cart will use 128k if found to get the extras you get on the 128k version.

I modified the code so that you can start the game by pressing fire and if you do P is the pause button (to map to the gx4000 pause button). The title screen shows, you can press fire to skip it or leave it for 30 seconds and it goes on it's own and into the game.

I didn't make any changes to the graphics, sound or gameplay.

[Bryce]

Are you including the homebrew carts and my conversions?

Which includes:

Blue Angel 69
Stryker and the Crypts of Trojan.

It would take me a while to get to 300!

No, just the original list from the Wiki.

Bryce.

[CraigsBar]

Just out of interest the "Unable to code the cartridge from the CPC" might be resolved. I have just sucessfully booted my 6128plus with no cartridge at all... How is this black magic achieved I hear you say....


Ok Here it is...


First I have one of Bryces Acid Inside boards in my 6128plus.
Second I have an X-MEM with FW3.15 and switched to boot from the x-mem firmware


when the machine is powered on with no cartridge the FW boots (Although clearly no disc commands work) ROM software works just fine - Tested with Protext, FutureOS, Chuckie Egg and 1942.


So If I can boot the machine and run ROM software without an issue with no cart installed. So long as the flash cart has a ACID in it, with an X-MEM you can obviously run a CPC plus with no cart at all.


Now here comes the problem. TO achieve maximum target audience, this device would need to also work on a GX4000 and as such it needs to work without any intervention from the machine (Or require an xmem to reprogram it)


Therefore Personally I think a microSD card 'Cartridge Emulator' type solution would be the way to go. Provide it with a full OS that can copy CPR images from an inserted SD card to its own emulated ROM.


A boot menu for access this OS or boot the current emulated ROM like the Plus Burning Rubber menu (Although obviously using joypad A and B rather than F1/F2) this way the dev's could use it as a programming tool. Users of all plus machines including the GX4000 couls use it to play 25 out of 26 official commercial games and everyone would be happy?


Sure this solution would cost more than a more basic cart, and I am sure the hardware and software guys will tell me a million reasons why none of this is possible but I would gladly hand over 100 hard earned euros (or More if it came with a nice shell/case) for such a device.


I realise that all of this would require a pretty damn intelligent cartridge with some built in CPU and file management tools. But impossible - I hope not.


After all I live in hope that one day we will gat this, and the day after one of those famous 2 Chase HQ2 carts will get dumped to CPR.


Craig

[chinnyhill10]

Essentially we're looking at a CPC equivalent of the 1541 Ultimate which is a highly specced cart for the C64 which costs approx 120 Euros.


http://www.1541ultimate.net/content/index.php?option=com_content&view=featured&Itemid=127


This is what I have for my Atari which is the My IDE (not the Side 2 as I said earlier). It's 70 US dollars:


Atarimax MyIDE-II Compact Flash Cartridge for Atari XL/XE Computers


Much cheaper. Cart case not as nice as the 1541 Ultimate but you do get a choice of colours and like the 1541 Ultimate it's a pretty powerful device.

[mr_lou]

Essentially we're looking at a CPC equivalent of the 1541 Ultimate which is a highly specced cart for the C64 which costs approx 120 Euros.

No, that's not what we're looking at.
The 1541 Ultimate is not a cartridge-emulator / multicartridge. It is more like a 1541 drive emulator. It doesn't contain cartridge images. It contains disk (d64) images.
The CPC has the HxC for this.

What we want is more like a CPC equivalent of the C64 Easy Flash cartridge.
EasyFlash 3 - RETRO Innovations

But in a version that allows storage of CPR files on SD card.