CPCWiki forum

General Category => Amstrad CPC hardware => Topic started by: Optimus on 10:50, 27 November 13

Title: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: Optimus on 10:50, 27 November 13
So, I bought a GX4000 with Burning Rubber, need to find more games, but are expensive and can't find most of the titles on ebay. And most of them as I remember them on emulator, I didn't liked them.


Is there some hardware or something, a cartidge where I can copy emulator images or something?
Can the GX4000 in some way run also CPC+ demos?


Also, I use the tv-cable, but I get some jumping line sometimes. I know the console has a scart, and I tried to use a scart from my playstation but doesn't display signal. Do I need a specific kind of scart cable?
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: arnoldemu on 14:04, 27 November 13
Quote from: Optimus on 10:50, 27 November 13
So, I bought a GX4000 with Burning Rubber, need to find more games, but are expensive and can't find most of the titles on ebay. And most of them as I remember them on emulator, I didn't liked them.
What about the best ones? Pang, Switchblade and Navy Seals?

Quote from: Optimus on 10:50, 27 November 13
Is there some hardware or something, a cartidge where I can copy emulator images or something?
There are various methods.

One method involves hacking an existing cart and putting a EPROM or Flash on it.
Both of which need to be programmed from PC using programmer hardware.

Another involves a flash cart on a board that sits between the eprom and the computer (the man-in-the-middle).

You may have a bit of luck with a CTC-AY cart which can be programmed from CPC. But need to verify it will override the roms in a cart.


Quote from: Optimus on 10:50, 27 November 13
Can the GX4000 in some way run also CPC+ demos?
I doubt it, because most will be using 128k RAM. GX4000 has only 64k ram.
There may be some that will run in 64k, but then you'll need to get them onto a cart - No$cash's tool can help there, I have some other tools which I will release one day, but these need more programmer interaction.

Don't give up though more stuff is on it's way - I hacked Stryker to work on GX4000 and more is probably on the way soon.



Quote from: Optimus on 10:50, 27 November 13
Also, I use the tv-cable, but I get some jumping line sometimes. I know the console has a scart, and I tried to use a scart from my playstation but doesn't display signal. Do I need a specific kind of scart cable?
I always use a RF cable or a Plus monitor. Both work fine.
I've not seen this problem.
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: Munchausen on 14:36, 27 November 13
Add some more RAM, an FDD controller and a keyboard, and you've got yourself a 6128+ :D


So Bryce, how's your FDD controller going? When it's done it will make GX4000 conversions much easier!
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: dragon on 15:56, 27 November 13
QuoteAnother involves a flash cart on a board that sits between the eprom and the computer (the man-in-the-middle).

But man in the middle is not an option, if you no know how construct a pcb :( .

So the best is buy burning rubber at 8e, and canibalize it.

In the other hand The trade in post games are not expensive only 9.


http://www.myciti.es/shop.php?parent_id=199&user_id=100009 (http://www.myciti.es/shop.php?parent_id=199&user_id=100009)
http://www.tradeinpost.com/www.tradeinpost.com/gx4000.txt (http://www.tradeinpost.com/www.tradeinpost.com/gx4000.txt)
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: Optimus on 16:19, 27 November 13
Wow, I didn't know that trading post site. I was just looking at ebay.
Yep, some are good, I remember switchblade on old CPC. And Pang version must be great too. It's only that the best ones are hard to find.
Robocop 2 or Navy Seals had good scrolling, but I found them hard to play. But still I might consider buying, just to see the capabilities of the console.
I didn't know the console had only 64k, I thought it was closer to the 6128+


Anyway, good find!


Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: Optimus on 19:43, 27 November 13
Is this tradingpost safe? There is a crappy form where you put your card number and the things you want to buy on your own. What?
Well, I did. And I am a bit afraid about it. I just got a message "Thank you. It has been sent"


Did you buy something from this before?


p.s. Then again, I found a scart to scart cable from poundland and it works like a charm. Yey!
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: dragon on 22:14, 27 November 13
Yes, is safety, i buy part of my collectión here time ago. I contact he first to ask shipping cost and i pay with paypal.  0 problems with cartridges. I never use the form really only hotmail. :) .

PD: klax and no exit are csd type cartridges.

PD2: another good site to buy is priceminister.com I can send you a Protection if you want, so with lucky you gain 7e discount to buy a gx4000 game, and with lucky i gain 7e to buy another burnin rubber in priceminister :) . I only need your email.
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: ralferoo on 01:29, 28 November 13
I have Pang, it's awesome! :)

It's one of the very few retro games I still play even now. Mr Do! on MAME is another, I'd love to get the arcade board sometime... :)
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: arnoldemu on 10:23, 28 November 13
Quote from: Optimus on 19:43, 27 November 13
Is this tradingpost safe?
Yes it is.

I don't use the form - no need I am in the UK. I have sent a cheque and a letter before. They are always reliable.

Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: Optimus on 10:28, 28 November 13
Maybe I should contact too.
I just didn't understand the point of the form (it only asks me to give the card number in front but not the small number in the back, it's not gonna work).
Maybe I shouldn't just give these. I was scared yesterday that it was a scam. Anyway..
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: nitrofurano on 12:10, 12 December 13
and, for example, how can we patch the games from Amstrad CPC 16KBs ROM Game Development Competition 2013 - CPCWiki (http://www.cpcwiki.eu/index.php/Amstrad_CPC_16KBs_ROM_Game_Development_Competition_2013) to run on gx4000? and how can we create, like from Pasmo, stuff for that, .cpr files ready to run on emulators like Mess?
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: nitrofurano on 12:11, 12 December 13
Quote from: arnoldemu on 14:04, 27 November 13
Don't give up though more stuff is on it's way - I hacked Stryker to work on GX4000 and more is probably on the way soon.


if you could help doing this on Mojon Twin's ones, would be amazing!
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: MacDeath on 16:28, 15 December 13
Those mojon twins games in mode1 could use some Hardsprites and raster palette changes... would really look great.

Lala the magical prologue per example... Sir Abitemolle** and so on...

Otherwise I see no point to port those on GX4000 Cartridges.

They would be just perfectly fit for some plus addon : the 16x6 sprites are limited so the GX/PLUS could really get its sprites at work on this.
Those would be Mode1 Games with nice colourfull feeling then.





**spéciale dédicace aux francophones...
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: arnoldemu on 18:04, 30 December 13
Quote from: nitrofurano on 12:10, 12 December 13
and, for example, how can we patch the games from Amstrad CPC 16KBs ROM Game Development Competition 2013 - CPCWiki (http://www.cpcwiki.eu/index.php/Amstrad_CPC_16KBs_ROM_Game_Development_Competition_2013) to run on gx4000? and how can we create, like from Pasmo, stuff for that, .cpr files ready to run on emulators like Mess?
There is no one way to patch a game to make it work on cartridge. Each game is different so each patch will be different.

It is easier if a game doesn't use firmware or basic, most of the hard work is done.

We must then patch it to load from cartridge (using my cartridge filesystem for example) and make sure it can be controlled with joysticks.
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: arnoldemu on 18:05, 30 December 13
Quote from: nitrofurano on 12:11, 12 December 13

if you could help doing this on Mojon Twin's ones, would be amazing!
these *may* be more easy because the code is available. In these we must alter the code to work better for plus.

I plan to patch some more games in the new year.
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: MacDeath on 21:16, 30 December 13
Anyway, where is the kickstarter to get those new GX4000 produced ?


Would need :
=ACID equivalent
=Cards
=other components
= plastic casing.


who goes ?
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: arnoldemu on 21:59, 30 December 13
I could help with making inlay and booklet.

Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: arnoldemu on 14:22, 11 January 14
Quote from: arnoldemu on 21:59, 30 December 13
I could help with making inlay and booklet.
My attempt at re-creating the plus cartridge label. This is a fictional label ;)

Made using LibreOffice:
http://www.cpctech.org.uk/plus_cart_label.odt (http://www.cpctech.org.uk/plus_cart_label.odt)

I have setup a label document.
I have setup the 3 text areas in a way that the text can be entered and it will be rotated as appropiate.
I have added a text area for the spine with a red-white gradient on it, with 2 text areas for the copyright and the main name.

So in theory this could be printed and put direct onto a cart.

This assumes standard sized cart design.

I purposely made it look like a cart you would normally get.

PDF:
http://www.cpctech.org.uk/plus_cart_label.pdf (http://www.cpctech.org.uk/plus_cart_label.pdf)
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: arnoldemu on 15:08, 11 January 14
NOTE: When viewing the cartridge label in the pdf, you can't see the actual size of it :( I thought the pdf may be the correct size I defined, but it's got extra white space.
The manual appears ok as a pdf.

My attempt at a manual for a cart game. Uses the same dimensions as the original manual.

http://www.cpctech.org.uk/plus_cart_manual.odt (http://www.cpctech.org.uk/plus_cart_manual.odt)
http://www.cpctech.org.uk/plus_cart_manual.pdf (http://www.cpctech.org.uk/plus_cart_manual.pdf)

For both of these you could use them to create your own if you wanted. I have setup the page styles but not the paragraph styles.

Now, I don't know what to do about the inlay for the box. I could go with original size, or I could go with VHS.
I also thought, for how long would we be able to get VHS sized boxes?


EDIT: Not sure how to tell libreoffice to print it in a way that can be put together with a stapler in the same way that the original manuals are done.
I will need to research that.
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: arnoldemu on 10:34, 13 January 14
This may be the method:

https://help.gnome.org/users/gnome-help/stable/printing-booklet-duplex.html.en (https://help.gnome.org/users/gnome-help/stable/printing-booklet-duplex.html.en)
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: arnoldemu on 10:43, 28 January 14
Quote from: arnoldemu on 14:22, 11 January 14
My attempt at re-creating the plus cartridge label. This is a fictional label ;)
OR is actually fact?
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: MacDeath on 14:04, 29 January 14
sorry but booklets and labels are not a priority...
But thx anyway. ::)



would be better to have :
=PCB design/blueprint in format needed to launch a production.
=components list : of course we aim at cost efficiency a bit, so a stack can be purchased.
=blueprint in 3D for the casing, also it would be cool that this were compatible with plastic mold/injection standards of production.


with those 3 elements, we may then put a price on the thing.


But I guess it would need something like 1000 pieces to have almost interesting prices... so it needs a quite large amount of money to begin...


if such things are available, then perhaps some coders would produce some specific games, had enough CPC ports...


a stack of 1000 blank cartridges (or the elements to be assembled) could enable like 10 games produced at 100 pieces each.
on long term it could sell all if products are of good quality.


I mean, lots of "professional collectionners" do have a GX4000. an average yet good enough game could sell at 50 units minimum easily.


and having 512K cartridges would enable huge use of overscan screens, some sampled sounds and so on...
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: arnoldemu on 15:01, 29 January 14
Quote from: MacDeath on 14:04, 29 January 14
sorry but booklets and labels are not a priority...
Yes I understand, but it's also true that there is not yet many new cart games released.

It now means there is less of "we don't have any games/manuals/labels released, so why bother making the pcbs/cases".
We now have at least one game (stryker) with more to follow from me, a template for a booklet and a template for a label.
In my way I am trying to push it towards a physical release.

So I will continue to release games on cartridge, each game will have a cartridge release, but each will differ in how much of the plus features I choose to use. Each time I make a cartridge release I will try to use more plus features. It is harder work to go back and add plus features to a released game. Better to plan their use when you make it.

I *will* be releasing a cart version of Blue Angel 69. I do have one ready but not using plus features. it uses my cart filesystem, it uses 256K cartridge (not compressed). It's the disc version, compatible with GX4000 but of course without any "loading" messages.

I will use 2 plus features in it but not more I would rather make use of more plus features in my next release.

Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: MacDeath on 17:37, 29 January 14
if it only uses 256K then go for a 2 games cartridge... ;)
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: arnoldemu on 18:49, 29 January 14
Quote from: MacDeath on 17:37, 29 January 14
if it only uses 256K then go for a 2 games cartridge... ;)
I know what you're saying is the best:
* use full 512k
* make it for plus

Both of these will take me too long at this time. So i will continue to release smaller carts and build up to 512k.
I can't commit to a 512k only plus game at this time - I am far too busy.
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: arnoldemu on 19:55, 29 January 14
Quote from: MacDeath on 17:37, 29 January 14
if it only uses 256K then go for a 2 games cartridge... ;)
Cart collections would be cool:

- all of hewsons cpc games on one cart
- all ocean's good games on one cart (not so much of their earlier stuff).
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: MacDeath on 20:36, 29 January 14
not sure those would do 512K only...
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: TFM on 19:04, 31 January 14
IMHO... Cartridges run on the Plus only, so they should contain games for the Plus and not CPC oG. Games not using the Plus features are a waste of Carts. As told: IMHO.

Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: arnoldemu on 19:17, 31 January 14
Quote from: TFM on 19:04, 31 January 14
IMHO... Cartridges run on the Plus only, so they should contain games for the Plus and not CPC oG. Games not using the Plus features are a waste of Carts. As told: IMHO.

Who is making plus only games?
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: TFM on 06:41, 01 February 14
Quote from: arnoldemu on 19:17, 31 January 14
Who is making plus only games?


Everybody who ever released a commercial Cart.  ;)
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: MacDeath on 13:53, 01 February 14
this debate reminds me a vicious circle :
= no hardware to actually release cartridges games exist, so no one would develop games for it.
= no one develops games for PLUScartridges so no one would produce blank cartridges...

and the circle is rounded. >:(

still such production could always find some decent sellings jsut with 4games compilations, as some games are quite rare these days...
Pang, magic pinball, Panza... they are impossible to find as original.

Batman or Barbarian2 or Klax wouldn't make sense as re-release because you can simply play the CPC version...
even awfull bad slightly modded games like Wildstreet or CrazyCar2 wouldn't be needed...

but the Good or average specific exploiting ASIC games are pain in the arschen to find anyway.
And homebrew modern games with slights added features can anyway get huge gain actually.

Rick dangerous 128 PLUS is a good example of what can be gained.

just to aim for a production with 512K ROM/Flash/anything only models is a way to make it standard and cheaper, and then there's always a way to fill it... be it just to get the Locobasic added to it and other games...

if there are only 512K ROM, no use to get the various LK's implemented on the PCB I guess.

but yeah, need a quickstarter project to be done I guess.
As I told, an initial production for perhaps 1000 blank units could always find use and sell on medium/long term.
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: TFM on 19:23, 01 February 14
Quote from: MacDeath on 13:53, 01 February 14
this debate reminds me a vicious circle :
= no hardware to actually release cartridges games exist, so no one would develop games for it.
= no one develops games for PLUScartridges so no one would produce blank cartridges...


Well, here the update: Games are in the making of... and Cartridges are in the making of... right now ;-)
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: dragon on 20:11, 01 February 14
Quote from: MacDeath on 13:53, 01 February 14
this debate reminds me a vicious circle :
= no hardware to actually release cartridges games exist, so no one would develop games for it.
= no one develops games for PLUScartridges so no one would produce blank cartridges...

and the circle is rounded. >:(

still such production could always find some decent sellings jsut with 4games compilations, as some games are quite rare these days...
Pang, magic pinball, Panza... they are impossible to find as original.

Batman or Barbarian2 or Klax wouldn't make sense as re-release because you can simply play the CPC version...
even awfull bad slightly modded games like Wildstreet or CrazyCar2 wouldn't be needed...

but the Good or average specific exploiting ASIC games are pain in the arschen to find anyway.
And homebrew modern games with slights added features can anyway get huge gain actually.

Rick dangerous 128 PLUS is a good example of what can be gained.

just to aim for a production with 512K ROM/Flash/anything only models is a way to make it standard and cheaper, and then there's always a way to fill it... be it just to get the Locobasic added to it and other games...

if there are only 512K ROM, no use to get the various LK's implemented on the PCB I guess.

but yeah, need a quickstarter project to be done I guess.
As I told, an initial production for perhaps 1000 blank units could always find use and sell on medium/long term.

I think is a good idea offer empty cartridges, motherboard+acid simulation + case. Maybe is no sense made various games for you.But many people want to have the collection of games to play them on the console. And is best you can buy a empty cartridge and burn you the eemprom with the game you desire than having to search a burnin rubber to canibalize it.
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: arnoldemu on 12:54, 02 February 14
Quote from: TFM on 19:23, 01 February 14

Well, here the update: Games are in the making of... and Cartridges are in the making of... right now ;-)
So this is my view.

First I plan to offer cart versions of all my future games (and one past one). For these I will use one or more plus features.
In the future I already plan a game and heavily use the plus features with it with a possible cpc version later.

I don't see a problem with cpc games on cart if they are correctly adapted and use at least one plus feature (e.g. palette).
Cart games offer instant loading and instant start so they are great to plug in and play.
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: Gryzor on 18:17, 02 February 14
Indeed, cart collections of "normal" titles wouldn't be too bad. Of course Plus titles would be better, but why not benefit from the speed of cartridges for original titles, if we do have the cartridges?
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: TFM on 21:21, 02 February 14
Quote from: arnoldemu on 12:54, 02 February 14
Cart games offer instant loading and instant start so they are great to plug in and play.


That's right.  :)  On CPC oG it also can be achieved by using a MegaFlash f.e. However the Carts provide enhanced ROM banking, so a 16 KB block of ROM can be banked in at 0, &4000, &8000 or &C000. That's especially a gain when working with more than 16 KB V-RAM.  ;)
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: MacDeath on 01:51, 03 February 14
my exact opinion as well...
If it is jsut for old CPC games go for a simple MegaFlash from the wonderfull Bryce.


The Cartridges are more for something like playing with GX4000 at badass big games..
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: Gryzor on 09:55, 03 February 14
You can use the MegaFlash if you can fit it in 16KB or split it into 16KB chunks though...
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: TFM on 18:17, 03 February 14
Quote from: Gryzor on 09:55, 03 February 14
You can use the MegaFlash if you can fit it in 16KB or split it into 16KB chunks though...


You have to do the same for Cart games since cartridges use 16 KB blocks too.




But I don't think that you would buy a Cartridge for 20 Euros, just to see some old CPC games. And yes, 20 Euros is pure production cost of it. Not a Pfennig earned by someone.

Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: Gryzor on 19:43, 05 February 14
Oops, sorry, I retract.
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: TFM on 20:14, 05 February 14
Could get down to around 12 Euro using an ACID replacement though. Still... it should be really full with software ;-)
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: arnoldemu on 10:45, 27 March 14
Any news on cartridge shells or cartridge pcbs?

Anyone working on cartridge games?

Any news on Plus version of Sorcery?
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: GOB on 14:30, 31 March 14
Plus version of sorcery ? Is anybody make that ? Who ?
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: arnoldemu on 18:17, 05 April 14
Quote from: GOB on 14:30, 31 March 14
Plus version of sorcery ? Is anybody make that ? Who ?
Trebmint was working on it.
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: GOB on 23:45, 05 April 14
Thanks, I saw the subject since. But I understand that unfortunately he had abandoned ...
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: arnoldemu on 18:01, 12 August 14
Quote from: nitrofurano on 12:10, 12 December 13
and, for example, how can we patch the games from Amstrad CPC 16KBs ROM Game Development Competition 2013 - CPCWiki (http://www.cpcwiki.eu/index.php/Amstrad_CPC_16KBs_ROM_Game_Development_Competition_2013) to run on gx4000? and how can we create, like from Pasmo, stuff for that, .cpr files ready to run on emulators like Mess?

use pasmo to generate a .bin file with no header (--bin).
Then use buildcpr on my website to convert it into a cpr file.
Now you can use it on mess.
Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: TFM on 18:27, 12 August 14
Does it work with WinApe too?

Title: Re: GX4000, what to do with it?
Post by: arnoldemu on 09:30, 13 August 14
Quote from: TFM on 18:27, 12 August 14
Does it work with WinApe too?
yes that method does.

EDIT: The method is not for converting 16KB roms, but for making a cartridge file you can use on emulators.
Powered by SMFPacks Menu Editor Mod