Man-In-The_Middle (MITM) Cartridge - Possible batch.

[Bryce]

Hi all,
     I finally found a reliable supplier for decent 36way edge connectors and have the possibility to make a batch of the MITM Cartridge:  MITM - CPCWiki
Is anyone still interested in having any of these? They would probably cost around €16 each or €23 if you want the EPROM (512K) included. If so, state your interest here so that I can plan the batch size.

These are ideal for releasing cartridge software without requiring a ACID chips or CPLD ACID replacements.

Bryce.

[robcfg]

Count me in for one of those!





With Eprom included, please...

[jrodriguezv]

I'm also interested in one with EPROM

[MaV]

Yay! Two with EPROMS, please!

[MacDeath]

reminds me this strange video I once saw by error on youp... oh wait... yeah, what is the price ? how do I can get this ? can it have a flash ROM so it can be easily written from any machine ?

[elspuddy]

can the flash rom come pre programed

[XorA]

I would be interested in one please!

[mr_lou]

Put me down for one too. 

[redbox]

They are a great idea and I would like one, buuuuut...

I know the ROMs aren't flashable (from the CPC) and the problem is I'd like to be able to easily remove the ROM so I can put it in my programmer and try lots of different stuff whilst developing. Guess this would require a ZIF socket and guess again that this won't work because of the profile and the fact it needs to fit into a Plus sized cartridge socket...?

Am I right or can it be done another way?

[endangermice]

What would be really cool is some sort of flash based cartridge that allowed you to our cartridge images onto an SD card. This could incorporate some software that provides you with a menu to select the cartridge and then copies it to some on board RAM at the correct addresses, reboots the CPC which then starts executing the code from the RAM. I know it has been done on the SNES but I guess there really aren't enough consoles and pluses to make it cost effective...

[Munchausen]

There are also not that many cartridge games, I guess you could probably make a multi-cart with all the existing games on it more easily.

[endangermice]

I guess in that case it would be great if it could load snapshot files too.

[Bryce]

The MITM was meant as the lowest cost solution I could make because it doesn't require an ACID or any other ICs, which makes it the cheapest way to distribute new software on a cartridge. It was meant for things like Cyber Chicken or other new games that wished to offer a cartridge version without the cost of ACIDs or CPLDs. There are several other cartridges I could make:

1 - MultiCartridge (16x128K ROMs) with CPLD ACID
2 - CPC Writeable cartridge (1x 256K) with CPLD ACID (was actually meant for software development)
3 - 4x 128K Multi MITM

For obvious reasons, all of these are going to be a lot more expensive that an MITM (except No. 3, which would only be ca. €10 more expensive). What would people prefer? What doesn't make sense to me is:

a) Anything that requires a battery.
b) Using the MITM method on bigger cartridges due to physical size.
c) SD card solutions, due to complexity = cost and due to the limited amount of software available for cartridge.

The problem is, the MITM only works reliably because the PCB is so small that the original cartridge is still half way in the CPC slot, as soon as I add anything to the PCB, the cartridge is balanced outside which isn't good for the CPCs cartridge slot or riser board. Please discuss, or should I start a Poll?

Bryce.

[redbox]

The huge benefit to such a project would be for development purposes, which in turn supports releases.

What started as a workaround for the ACID could be turned into a developers dream, i.e. flashable ROM or an easily removable ROM for programming.  That way, new software can easily be developed for the Plus cartridge (which at the moment is a huge headache) and in turn also be released easily.  An SD CARD solution isn't really required - the flashing could be done in the same way as it already is for the MegaFlash etc.

Whether that's achievable or not is unfortunately way beyond my expertise...!

[Bryce]

Yes, but as soon as I add any more functionality the Man-in-the-middle part becomes pointless because (A) the PCB is too big (B) it now contains a CPLD that can do the ACID part. So any changes will remove the MITM solution and make it a completely different product.

The MITM solution is still the lowest cost for a Game release, what you are talking about is a parallel project for a completely different purpose.

Bryce.

[Munchausen]

Well regardless, I'd like a MITM please!

[Bryce]

It looks like I'll probably make a small batch of MITM, then after that I'll do a poll of what type of writeable/multiCart I should make. Either way, I really need to get the DDI-2 finished first... After I've finished the current (non-CPC) projects I'm working on.

Bryce.

[redbox]

Yes, but as soon as I add any more functionality the Man-in-the-middle part becomes pointless because (A) the PCB is too big (B) it now contains a CPLD that can do the ACID part. So any changes will remove the MITM solution and make it a completely different product.
The MITM solution is still the lowest cost for a Game release, what you are talking about is a parallel project for a completely different purpose.

Absolutely, wasn't knocking it in any way as it's an elegant and practical solution.

Was just adding to the "wishlist" as you did say "discuss" 

[Gryzor]

I'll go for the second product... I think the MITM one discussed is very useful, but to a very few people.

[mr_lou]

I'll go for the second product... I think the MITM one discussed is very useful, but to a very few people.

My vote also goes to the 2nd option. Sounds awesome.

[MaV]

I'll vote for the 2nd option, as well!

[Bryce]

Ok, if most people find option 2 the most interesting, then I'll look at making that first and forget about making the original MITM completely.

Bryce.

[Gryzor]

Poll time? Maybe devs haven't weighed in just yet.

[Munchausen]

The second one would be really handy I agree, as I wouldn't need any other cartridge then but I think I'd still need a system cartridge to actually do the programming? (I don't have a system cartridge right now as I don't have a plus but have been planning to upgrade my GX4000 at some point, I need a DDI-2 or DDI-1 clone though!).

[mr_lou]

MITM would probably be more interesting to GX4000 owners though?