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General Category => News & Events => Topic started by: NewsBot on 00:00, 10 July 10

Title: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: NewsBot on 00:00, 10 July 10
Arkos Tracker v1.0 (http://www.octoate.de/wp/2010/07/09/arkos-tracker-v1-0/)
9 July 2010, 10:22 pm

Ok, here it is: The final version of the Arkos Tracker.

With the Arkos Tracker you can compose your chiptune music for the Amstrad CPC (and a variety of other computers), compile them and use the player for the specific system. The sound playback is done via emulation of the AY-3-891x soundchip on your PC or directly on an Amstrad CPC via the CPC Booster+.

You can download the new Beta version from the tools section (http://www.julien-nevo.com/arkos/tools.html) of the Arkos homepage (http://www.julien-nevo.com/arkos/).

Changes:

(http://www.octoate.de/wp/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/arkostracker1-300x224.png) (http://www.octoate.de/wp/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/arkostracker1.png)



© Octoate for Octoate.de - The Amstrad CPC news portal (http://www.octoate.de/wp), 2010. |  Permalink (http://www.octoate.de/wp/2010/07/09/arkos-tracker-v1-0/) |  No comment (http://www.octoate.de/wp/2010/07/09/arkos-tracker-v1-0/#comments) |  Add to  del.icio.us (http://del.icio.us/post?url=http://www.octoate.de/wp/2010/07/09/arkos-tracker-v1-0/&title=Arkos%20Tracker%20v1.0)    Post tags: 2010 (http://www.octoate.de/wp/tag/2010/), arkos (http://www.octoate.de/wp/tag/arkos/), chiptune (http://www.octoate.de/wp/tag/chiptune/), music (http://www.octoate.de/wp/tag/music/), sound (http://www.octoate.de/wp/tag/sound/), targhan (http://www.octoate.de/wp/tag/targhan/), tracker (http://www.octoate.de/wp/tag/tracker/), windows (http://www.octoate.de/wp/tag/windows/) 

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This news item first appeared on Octoate's Blog and was aggregated through RSS for the forum.
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0
Post by: mr_lou on 10:34, 10 July 10
In these modern times, where there are a lot of alternatives to Windows, any thread about a program should state what platform it's for.
"Arkos Tracker v1.0 for Windows" would be the correct title for this thread in my opinion.
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0
Post by: Gryzor on 10:45, 12 July 10
Well, Octoate writes for a dedicated and educated public, and those who follow things (whom Octoate addresses) do know what it's for - he has presented it in detail before...
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0
Post by: mr_lou on 16:56, 12 July 10
In these modern times, where there are a lot to follow everywhere, there are some people who doesn't follow everything everywhere all the time. News-posts should contain as much info as possible.

I stand by my opinion that the platform name should be included in all posts about a program, if it's only developed for 1 platform.

I don't remember last time I read about Arkos Tracker, but I remember someone being interested in the source with the intention of porting it to Linux. Maybe this has been done. I can't know from that news-post.

Addresses only people who follow things? Then what I'm saying is, that people ought to address everyone else as well. It's not that difficult.

And adding the platform-name definitely isn't an extra effort. It's a good thing to do, when/if there'll be a Linux version later, so it's easy to distinguish the two versions.

But everyone has the right to be conservative of course.
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0
Post by: Octoate on 18:23, 12 July 10
This is a posting from my websites RSS feed, which means that I am the writer of this new article. I tag my new postings and I think that this is enough - at least for my site, which means that I won't change the way I write my topics in the future.
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0
Post by: mr_lou on 18:28, 12 July 10
I didn't expect you to. But I still think you should, as should everyone else. Just my opinion, and I'm sticking with it.
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0
Post by: TFM on 00:00, 13 July 10
And I think it's better to keep it shorter, exactly like it is. Because everybody can "see" the target platform. And if not, reding some lines of text will not kill somebody  :P   To make it more clear: Read the tags  ;)
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0
Post by: mr_lou on 08:14, 13 July 10
I see a huge advantage in having 1 place to read all CPC news. This is what newsbot does for us. It could also be transformed into an RSS feed, so that we could follow CPC news everywhere, e.g. from a mobile phone. That would be really sweet in my opinion.

If however we have to click each news to find out more, then it loses some value (a lot to me). I can't see how you can argue against that.
But no I don't expect everyone to start writing news posts in a form that makes it more valuable for such a 1 place. That would be pretty naive of me to think everyone could see the advantage in that.
I am surprised though, that no one seems to see the advantage. It looks like you choose not to think about it for a moment, and instead feel a need to "support" the writer of the post, as if you feel I'm attacking the writers. I'm not.
When new things emerge, new procedures are adapted. Doesn't mean the old way of doing things were wrong.
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0
Post by: Devilmarkus on 09:41, 13 July 10
I think this:
When a program is announced, and is not written "For Öpple Möc" or "For Lunix" we all suggest first, it's a Windumbs app ;)
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: Gryzor on 10:07, 13 July 10
I am surprised though, that no one seems to see the advantage.

Well, to tell you the truth, I'm surprised that you make such a big deal out of it. Ok, so Octoate wrote his article with people who already know about the program in mind, and it was fetched here. You could just ask "hey, what platform is this for?" and the author would get the message, instead of launching into a diatribe about how he should formulate his titles... This is getting a bit long in the tooth and does favors to no one :)

Here, I changed the article's title for you =)
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: mr_lou on 13:03, 13 July 10
When a program is announced, and is not written "For Öpple Möc" or "For Lunix" we all suggest first, it's a Windumbs app ;)

Could also be for the CPC or the CPC+.

I'm surprised that you make such a big deal out of it.

I don't think I am. I think you are.
But I give up now, as it seems no matter what I write, it's not understood the way I want it to.
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: Devilmarkus on 13:09, 13 July 10
Could also be for the CPC or the CPC+.

Sure, this

(http://www.octoate.de/wp/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/arkostracker1-300x224.png)

is a CPC 464 application...
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: arnoldemu on 13:13, 13 July 10
But I give up now, as it seems no matter what I write, it's not understood the way I want it to.
I understand you.

I am not sure this would be possible without the original source also indicating the machine type.
Then this would be possible here.

I agree with what you say because it takes extra time to look at the news and discover if it is relevant to your interest.

Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: Gryzor on 13:31, 13 July 10
@mr_lou: it's NOT like I don't understand you. But please do read what I wrote because it's obvious you haven't: you could just ask "what's this for" and the author would get the message. It'd be that simple.

LOL @ Markus :D
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: mr_lou on 14:07, 13 July 10
@Markus: My initial post say "A thread about an app should have platform mentioned in the title". An image is not in the title, is it?
Any app can be for a lot of platforms, but it's usually only for 1 or few. Even your JavaCPC is infact for Windows only, isn't it? At least it's not optimal for Linux, because of lack of speed, and because it uses a lot of Windows specific tools. How many people do you think assumes "JavaCPC" will run on their Linux machine? And how many do you think assumes "JavaCPC for Windows" will run on their Linux machine?

@Gryzor: Yes I read what you wrote. What's obvious to you is infact not the truth. You on the other hand have clearly not read what I wrote. The whole thing is about easy access to news, quick info. Why would I want to write to the author?? I might as well use Google from the start then, instead of this newsbot.

One last time for the daft: This has got nothing to do with Octoate, or whatever posts he has written in the past. This is just my opinion about how people ought to write news posts in the future, in order to give a service like Newsbot more value.

Anyone still not getting it, read my posts again. Still not getting it, then don't reply, you'll never get it anyway.
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: mr_lou on 14:08, 13 July 10
I understand you.

I am not sure this would be possible without the original source also indicating the machine type.
Then this would be possible here.

I agree with what you say because it takes extra time to look at the news and discover if it is relevant to your interest.

Thank you.
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: Gryzor on 14:31, 13 July 10
I think I see something in there; you seem to propose that this feature becomes an all-around aggregator and a reference point, and that news authors of other sites should adapt their writing with this in mind - am I correct?

Well, it'd be nice, but I don't  really want to step over other people's feet... this is just that - a collection of things that others posted on their sites, for their audience. I'm considering actually using such a feature for the wiki itself, to enrich the news flow, but again it's not like Octoate or any Octoate writes their news for syndication :)
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: Devilmarkus on 14:33, 13 July 10
How many people do you think assumes "JavaCPC" will run on their Linux machine? And how many do you think assumes "JavaCPC for Windows" will run on their Linux machine?

Well:
Theoretically it 'should' run under Linux as well as under Mac OS.
There's no reason (in code) why it should not.
Mac OS user need Java 1.6 at least.
Linux user need good sound implementation in Java.
Also some Windows users have the same problem.
(I once run it on a Windows PC with a Realtek soundcard and it ran too slow)

But:
Theoretically there's no reason why JavaCPC shouldn't run on Linux machines, too.
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: Targhan on 15:41, 13 July 10
Arkos Tracker is for Windows ? Yes, but not only : the command line tools that go with it run under Linux/Mac OsX with Mono. A complicated issue, isn't it ? :)
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: TFM on 21:13, 13 July 10
One last time for the daft: This has got nothing to do with Octoate, or whatever posts he has written in the past. This is just my opinion about how people ought to write news posts in the future, in order to give a service like Newsbot more value.

Hey Mr Lou! If you want to have it that way, then I have a very easy solution for you:
Built up your own news page, and the Wiki-Robot will post all your news here in exactly your style.
 
I'm looking forward for your news portal :-)
 
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: Gryzor on 23:28, 13 July 10

Hey Mr Lou! If you want to have it that way, then I have a very easy solution for you:
Built up your own news page, and the Wiki-Robot will post all your news here in exactly your style.
 
I'm looking forward for your news portal :-)
 

Hey man, this was uncalled-for... no need to be so hostile...
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: TFM on 04:05, 14 July 10
Hey man, this was uncalled-for... no need to be so hostile...

Hostile? Don't you see the :-) Pick you own nose ;-)
 
My opinion is... if you want it exactly your way, just do it by yourself. What's wrong with that?
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: Gryzor on 10:31, 14 July 10
Well, for starters, you were being, intentionally or not, ironic. A smiley at the end doesn't cut it...

And, on a philosophical level, the theory of "if you want it exactly your way do it yourself" doesn't hold much water. Not practical. Doesn't make any sense. So I don't like how the buttons on my HTC HD2 work, should I build one on my own? :D
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: Targhan on 15:14, 14 July 10
You guys are bothering me. I'm building my own forum with bots to talk to.


I'm sorry, I forgot :
 :) .
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: Gryzor on 16:48, 14 July 10
You guys are bothering me. I'm building my own forum with bots to talk to.


I sorry, I forgot :
:).

Prize post :D
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: TFM on 22:57, 15 July 10
Well, for starters, you were being, intentionally or not, ironic. A smiley at the end doesn't cut it...

Maybe you're right, maybe one can get it in the wrong throat. The intension was motivation to do something or to start something. Since Mr. Lou has precise ideas how it shall look like, why not relize it that way. Future will show how it runs and if people like it. But first it must be realized.
 

And, on a philosophical level, the theory of "if you want it exactly your way do it yourself" doesn't hold much water. Not practical. Doesn't make any sense.

You have not one argument aginst my theory, and I've proofen it at least for me in my whole live. In Biology, informatics, chemistry and ever with my OS.
My theory may not work for you or everybody, but I'm sure it works for everybody with real targets.
And Gryzor, you've already proofen my theory by building up the CPCWiki! ;-)
 
So I don't like how the buttons on my HTC HD2 work, should I build one on my own? :D

If your dislike of the buttons is strong enought... Yes!
 
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: mr_lou on 07:50, 16 July 10
How different would this thread have looked, if my first post (http://cpcwiki.eu/forum/index.php/topic,1113.msg10995.html#msg10995) (my first reply, the second post), looked like this instead:

---
It would be really nice if all news-authors would put the name of the target-platform in the title of their news. That way a collection of cpc-news would be more useful, since you'd have a better overview of what's relevant to you and what's not.
This thread would thus be called "Arkos   Tracker v1.0 for Windows", and I'd know that I didn't care one bit about this since I run Linux.
---

I can't believe the replies I'm getting on various forums sometimes, but I suspect maybe I should be better at expressing myself. At least it's my experience, that people who don't know me usually interpret things I say in a rather negative way rather than in the productive way it was meant. (And it's getting rather tiring being stamped as a complainer when it's definitely not what I'm doing. Even more so when all subsequent attempts of explaining also fails). The written word is only 25% of what we say....
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: Gryzor on 10:28, 16 July 10
@TMF: actually, I did give an argument (the HTC one), and you quoted it, so it's so strange to claim that I didn't...

What you say does not make any sense because as a theory (or practice) it ignores the principle of competitive advantage and waste of resources.

I built the wiki not because there was something not good enough out there, but because there was nothing out there (actually at the time I think there were no retro wikis at all). But at this point, with our wiki having such a momentum and size, it makes absolutely no sense building something anew just to make it better: it makes much more sense to try and improve the current setup. Same thing with what Mr_Lou said.

@Mr_Lou: I think it's clear that you had no 'bad' intentions. What you wrote above is a small step but making a big difference, but I'll insist that the same result could be achieved with a simple "What platform is this for?". This way you provoke the thinking of the issue without actually making a suggestion to the author... it's all in the subtlety :)
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: mr_lou on 12:50, 16 July 10
But I'll insist that the same result could be achieved with a simple "What platform is this for?".

I find it rather stunning that you apparently still don't get, that the very reason I wanted to poke this idea into news-writers heads, was to avoid doing precisely what you say there. I wanted to have an overview of which news was relevant to me. This could be achieve by creating some advanced multi-user news-system and have everyone use that instead of their own personal blog - OR everyone could simply put in the title what platform the news item was about. I seriously doubt anyone would want to use an new advanced multi-user news-system rather than their own personal blog, so the put-platform-in-title idea seemed like a good idea to me.
But NEVER FUCKING MIND.  :) It's quite clear that poking ideas like this into the community is a mission impossible, and it's not that important to me either. It was just a nice-to-have thing, but I understand we'll never have it.
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: TFM on 19:35, 16 July 10
What you say does not make any sense because as a theory (or practice) it ignores the principle of competitive advantage and waste of resources.

In contrast, the principle of competitive advantage is bullshit, and it's prooven wrong. Teamwork is much more efficient. I expect a smart guy like you to know that.
 
However, worlds are colliding here. I see no need to discuss this more, since arguments become redundant.
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: Gryzor on 20:06, 16 July 10
@Mr_lou: I find it rather stunning that you don't understand that what you say could be equally achieved by doing what I suggested. People are not stupid (generally speaking, at least here, at least that's what I like to think) so that ever-subtle hint would sow the idea you seek to infuse. And I find it *absolutely* stunning that you haven't seen all the ideas that have flourished from this and similar communities... the mind boggles.

@TFM: as a holder of a very tough B.Sc. in Economic science and a couple postgrad degreeds in relevant matters, I can tell you that competitive (or comparative) advantage has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with teamwork or working alone. If that's what you have understood then clearly you haven't seen a single diagram explaining how it works. Plus, there are two funny things here: one, YOU suggested something going totally against the grain of collaboration ("do it yourself"), and two, competitive advantage is ALL for teamwork, just in broader areas. That's what you don't understand.

Oh, also: competitive advantage has been proven to be wrong? Let me LOL: HA, HA, HAR!!!!!! :D :D :D :D :D !!!!????!!!11!
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: TFM on 21:32, 16 July 10
@Gryzor: Hey Genius! Since german is no problem for you, I can only say: Der Klügere gibt nach ;-)
 
And these  :D  are really disgusting!
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: mr_lou on 21:43, 16 July 10
 :police: "So, I have this idea that we could set up the alarm system to automatically go online at 8 o'clock every evening."
 8) "You know, you can just turn it on manually at 8 o'clock"
 :police: "Yea, but it would be nice if it was automatic"
 8) "But you can achieve the same by doing it manually"
 :police: "No dude, I cannot. The difference is, I have to do some work with the manual solution."
 8) "WTF?! I'm bloody flourishing you with ideas here! Mind boggling."
 :police: "...right."
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: TFM on 21:54, 16 July 10
This  8)  guy seems to be really bullheaded!?!
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: Targhan on 02:17, 17 July 10
I'm really sorry for all the mess. Next time I do a software, I'll call it *cpc* Starkos or *Windows* Arkos Tracker. That will settle all this.

Yuk.

Trg.Aks
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: mr_lou on 08:41, 17 July 10
This has gone from ridiculous to interesting-experiment. Goal: Try to succeed in explaining the difference to the community. Maybe I need a poll: Do you get it? Yes/No

I'm really sorry for all the mess. Next time I do a software, I'll call it *cpc* Starkos or *Windows* Arkos Tracker. That will settle all this.

Difficult to know if you're being ironic or not at this stage, but it will settle nothing, that one developer or one news-writer does it, in relation to what I'm talking about. Sure, it'll be nice for that one piece of news, or that one piece of software. (And you're right that putting platform in the name of the product does automatically put it in all (I should hope) future news-posts too of course, so actually great alternative idea in that respect. But I'm pretty sure that less developers would put the platform in the name of their product, than news-writers would put it in their title).

And it really has no real effect before everything starts doing it. I'm wondering how many times I'll need to keep writing that before most members of this forum gets it. Maybe if I use some cases, in which we pretend there are 20 news-posts (and let's pretend they're all written in English as well).

CASE 1: All product developers and/or news-writers puts platform in the title of their product and/or news
Result: Newsbot gives me a clear overview of what's relevant to me without me needing to open the posts that aren't relevant to me. I find that maybe 7 of them are relevant to me. It took me 15 seconds to learn that, by looking at the overview. Wow! I find that to be quite groovy, that I could read what platform the app/game was for in the title.

CASE 2: All product developers and/or news-writers does as they've always done
Result: Alrighty, I have to click and open each of the 20 news-posts and see if the description contains something about platform. It probably doesn't, in which case I have to mail the author and ask, or visit his webpage to find out. Hmm... no, I'm too lazy to spend 15 minutes reading through all of those 20 posts, considering how little of it usually is relevant to me. So I end up not reading any of the news at all.

Now, I know that according to Einstein, time is relevant. But to me, there's a significant difference between 15 seconds and 15 minutes regardless of other circumstances. So I'm just puzzled how anyone can claim that I can achieve the same by asking the author about platform, or even just click the news-item and read.
YES! I KNOW I CAN DO THAT IN LACK OF BETTER, BUT THAT'S NOT THE ISSUE!

And let me repeat another thing: I do not expect people to start putting the platform in the name or their product or title of their news-post. I don't think it'll happen. It was just an idea. Getting a single person to understand the advantages of an idea can be hard enough sometimes, but getting a group of people to, is clearly a mission impossible. At this stage, it seems that it's best to never speak out about something that could be nice-to-have, when I know it'll never happen.
And this has never been a debate about getting people to do so or not. It has never been a discussion about setting a global standard. That's impossible. It has only been a debate about whether or not it would be beneficial if they did. Purely wishful thinking.
However, it's getting interesting to see how many posts is required for people to get that.

 :police: "It would be nice if all CPC news could be assembled into 1 filtered RSS feed"
 8) "You know, you can achieve the same by looking at the newsbot posts at CPC wiki"
 :police: "No dude, I cannot. That is not an RSS feed"
 8) "So? It gives you the same info"
 :police: "Let me speak slower. The keyword here is  R S S   f e e d.  And besides, the newsbot doesn't allow me to filter out anything. See? That's 2 whole differences. Not the same thing."
 8) "Well I don't need it to be a filtered RSS feed, so why would you?"
 :police: "... you're right. Everyone in the world has the same preferences as you. My bad. Sorry."
 8) "Ok I give up, why do you need a filtered RSS?"
 :police: "Because I'm 1) really not interested in French news for one thing. And 2) I'm not interested in Windows shit either. And 3) having an RSS feed would allow me to read the news on my phone. There, I explained it."
 8) "... you know you can achieve the same by asking the author. I can't believe you can't see that."
 :police: ".... anyone? I'm missing an icon of en elephant gun here. Can I have some kind of weapon to insert into this chat please? Anything. Just something that can do some serious damage to that other smiley face, the one with the sunglasses."
 8) "...It could be nice if someone game me a million euro"
 :police: "..."
 8) "Yea, that would be sweet."
 :police: "Hey, you can get a million euro by working hard and   saving up."
 8) "...yea, you're right."
 :police: "...not the same thing though, is it?"
 8) "...no"
 :police: " ;) "
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: Gryzor on 09:41, 17 July 10
I'm sorry, but right now I feel like:
[youtube=kQFKtI6gn9Y]Arguments...[/youtube]

:)

But, hey, how could you build a filtered RSS feed? This would require some serious tweaking...
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: mr_lou on 10:40, 17 July 10
But, hey, how could you build a filtered RSS feed? This would require some serious tweaking...

Well I can't, can I? Again, that's not what it's about.
It's only about, that: It could be sweet, if I could.
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: Targhan on 12:56, 17 July 10
MrLou : I haven't read your stuff. My last message was a joke. Oh, well...
Title: Re: Octoate's News - Arkos Tracker v1.0 ***FOR WINDOWS***
Post by: mr_lou on 13:05, 17 July 10
Don't worry. The reply is for those who didn't interpret it as a joke. It wasn't for you specifically.