Author Topic: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?  (Read 1506 times)

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Offline mr_lou

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Hi all!


The release date for 8-bit Memoirs; December 2017, is approaching fast, so it's time for me to start ordering the discs and cases and USB sticks I need in order to create copies for those of you who wish to support the project by buying a physical copy. I would like to create a few copies upfront before receiving any orders.

(Voting in this poll does not constitue a plea to buy. And prices aren't necessarily final either. I will take preorders later for those who wish to be first receivers).

I have come up with 3 different versions to offer:

"Full version" - for the collector
A 25 gb glossy water-shielded Blu-ray Disc with printed label (print-on-disc)
Blu-ray case with printed cover
Expected price (including shipping): 17 Euro

"Budget version" - for the too lazy to download and burn a disc yourself
A 25 gb budget Blu-ray Disc with no printed label, and not water-shielded either
Expected price (including shipping): 11 Euro

"USB version" - for the too lazy to download and copy to USB yourself
A 32 gb USB 2.0 stick for Windows / Linux / Mac. Requires a software media player with BD-J support to run (like e.g. VLC or PowerDVD). USB stick can be wiped and used for other stuff later if you want.
Expected price (including shipping): 23 Euro
Note about this version though: VLC isn't 100% ready for the project yet. VLC authors still need to implement a POPUP MENU button and/or catch number-keys on the keyboard. I have notified them about this, so hopefully it'll be implemented before December.

And remember, the whole project can also be downloaded for free. So these "commercial" versions are only for those of you who wish to support the project and/or is too lazy to download 25 gb and burn to a disc yourself.

Please vote to give me an idea of what to expect.

Thank you.

Any thoughts?
« Last Edit: 16:36, 11 September 17 by mr_lou »

Offline mr_lou

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Re: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?
« Reply #1 on: 15:06, 13 September 17 »
Hm, there appears to be a serious lack of interest in my project.

Maybe people don't appreciate CPC oriented diskmag-like creations as much as I thought they would.

To find out if that's the case, I've added a 5th option to the poll.

Please vote.

Offline ivarf

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Re: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?
« Reply #2 on: 20:46, 13 September 17 »

It all depends on the content. I guess most people here are not sure what to expect yet. 25 GB CPC orientated diskmag, what really is that? We are used to less than 180kB discmags


Maybe you could give a preview?

Offline mr_lou

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Re: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?
« Reply #3 on: 20:59, 13 September 17 »
It all depends on the content. I guess most people here are not sure what to expect yet. 25 GB CPC orientated diskmag, what really is that? We are used to less than 180kB discmags

Maybe you could give a preview?

There's an old YouTube preview at http://8bitmemoirs.com/
Gives you an idea of the atmosphere.

The reason for the 25 gb is because of all the videos and music I've included.

It's not really a diskmag though. It's just kinda diskmag-like. Diskmag'ish.
It's actually an eBook, built like a diskmag, to boost the retro feeling.
It's a book about experiencing the CPC (and others) as a kid.

Offline ivarf

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Re: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?
« Reply #4 on: 21:24, 13 September 17 »

Superman Cartoon from 1942 wow. I have to check if I find some of it on youtube...
Video 2000, never seen one of those. Were they popular in Denmark? Philips video 2000 had the best picture quality of the 3 formats have I heard.


I liked hearing about Zorro and how you experienced it as a child as well as seeing some gameplay.
I do not have a blueray player (yet), so I will go for the ISO-version when available.


Thank you for the read and experience

Offline mr_lou

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Re: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?
« Reply #5 on: 21:31, 13 September 17 »
Superman Cartoon from 1942 wow. I have to check if I find some of it on youtube...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sjdnCC6n4xk

 :)

Offline AMSDOS

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Re: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?
« Reply #6 on: 13:44, 14 September 17 »
The BLU-Ray Full Version sounds good! Where do I pay though?

Offline mr_lou

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Re: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?
« Reply #7 on: 14:29, 14 September 17 »
The BLU-Ray Full Version sounds good! Where do I pay though?

I was thinking of handling it through eBay.
But you gotta wait till December.  :)

Offline Shaun M. Neary

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Re: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?
« Reply #8 on: 23:22, 14 September 17 »
Hm, there appears to be a serious lack of interest in my project.

Maybe people don't appreciate CPC oriented diskmag-like creations as much as I thought they would.

To find out if that's the case, I've added a 5th option to the poll.

Please vote.
Opinion time here, and please do not take this personally as I still have an interest in seeing the final product.

It's not so much a lack of interest, but between the awkwardness of the formats and the size of it (a blu-ray magazine, and 25GB worth?) and the length of time it took for the first one to arrive, it's been a long time. I'm guessing for some (and I only speak for myself here), the wait has been a bit too long an it's a case of believe it when they see it.

Too much media content can kill a project like this too, I believe. We're a retro community, so I'm not really sure how much of a success a retro based mag will be when it's covered in videos. Myself, personally, I like to read stuff, if I want to watch videos, I'll go to youtube gaming.

Also in an era where physical media is dead, I wouldn't be surprised if it's mostly download. While I appreciate the time and effort you've put into this, I think it's just simply a case of it's dragged it's heels for too long and now that it's near completion, few people will pay that much for a blu-ray, a format that's slowly dying on it's knees thanks to streaming media and digital downloads and the postage costs when the download is freely available.

Offline mr_lou

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Re: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?
« Reply #9 on: 01:36, 15 September 17 »
Opinion time here, and please do not take this personally as I still have an interest in seeing the final product.

It's not so much a lack of interest, but between the awkwardness of the formats and the size of it (a blu-ray magazine, and 25GB worth?) and the length of time it took for the first one to arrive, it's been a long time. I'm guessing for some (and I only speak for myself here), the wait has been a bit too long an it's a case of believe it when they see it.

Too much media content can kill a project like this too, I believe. We're a retro community, so I'm not really sure how much of a success a retro based mag will be when it's covered in videos. Myself, personally, I like to read stuff, if I want to watch videos, I'll go to youtube gaming.

Also in an era where physical media is dead, I wouldn't be surprised if it's mostly download. While I appreciate the time and effort you've put into this, I think it's just simply a case of it's dragged it's heels for too long and now that it's near completion, few people will pay that much for a blu-ray, a format that's slowly dying on it's knees thanks to streaming media and digital downloads and the postage costs when the download is freely available.

Thanks for the feedback.

Well it's definitely true that issue #1 took far longer to create that I thought. But just to make sure there's no misunderstanding here: This is not really a mag, and I will not be producing any future issues.
8-bit Memoirs is a book. An eBook. With supplemental videos and background music for reading. So it's "an expanded book", but still just a book.
The idea is that other people will want to share their own stories too, when reading issue #1. Thus, each issue will be authored by different people.

Maybe there'll never be an issue #2. Depends entirely if anyone else will write it. Issue #1 is my issue. Anyone else is free to create future issues (which I would personally love to read). But issue #1 can easily stand alone too if that's how it ends.
Each author picks his own target platform. So issue #1 could easily be the only time Blu-ray is used. ;-)

But I also think I had to spend the extra necessary time to make this first issue as complete as possible. If there should be any chance of success, I couldn't put out a half finished project here.
I don't expect any future issues to be this big at all.

So the book is about how I experienced the Amstrad CPC (and others) back then as a kid. All the videos are merely supplemental to the stories. Optional to watch. Just nice to have available and handy when reading.
For example, I could be writing about the time I created something in BASIC, and add screenshots in the story. And then I'll add a video too for those curious to see the creation "live". You don't have to watch the videos if you just wanna read the stories - and vice versa.
For the first 4 years of the project, the plan was also to create a phone version without all the videos, and with a smaller background music playlist too. I might still do this later.

I can't consider Blu-ray media dead before the major gaming-consoles stops using it. But in any case, streaming media could never do this. This couldn't be turned into a bunch of videos. I've tried to explain this many times, but I just can't seem to get through to anyone:

8-bit Memoirs is a book. Streaming media doesn't allow you to do this. The only way I could turn 8-bit Memoirs into pure video would be to record it while I browse through the pages, like filming myself reading a paperbook. You would lose the whole feel.
The idea is instead that you will be sitting with your remote control and switching pages manually. (Or your game-console gamepad, or your PC keyboard or mouse). Just like you did with a diskmag in the good old days.

Anyway, mostly downloads is perfectly acceptable. I'm not aiming at selling a lot of Blu-ray discs here. That's not why I made it. The project has always been intended to be completely free. I know that the disc version is for the niche group + those who just wish to support the project.

I would be happy to snailmail you a betatest version. Maybe you could then explain it better than I can.

Other betatesters are also most welcome to join in here and share your first impression of the project, now that you've had a chance to experience it.

Offline tjohnson

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Re: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?
« Reply #10 on: 13:26, 16 September 17 »

Hey all, I offered to help Mr_Lous as a Beta tester for his 8 bit memoirs project.  I didn't really know what to expect when I offered but like most or all of us my formative years were in the 1980s and early 1990s and in the good old early days of computer games.


Mr_Lou sent me a blu-ray disk through the post and and I've got a PS3 and PS4 so like most people have easy access to a blu-ray player.  I've never really seen something like this before as when I was growing up it was all paper magazines like Amstrad Action, and obviously more recently everything has gone internet based and youtube and websites, I never really saw disk mags, so this is new to me.


Having now spent some time with the disk and reading Mr_lous stories about his memories of 8 bit computer games I feel the blu-ray format does suits the content very well.  The quality and standard is very high, very professional and clearly alot of effort has gone into this project which I guess is why it has taken a while to reach fruition.  This wouldn't work on Youtube as its not video based, as Mr_Lous says its like reading a book but with videos and some quality illustrations to support the content and the reader not the other way round.   If Mr_lou hosted it on a site it will probably eventually be lost like many sites that survive and then disappear after a few years leaving nothing but broken links and I'm not sure it would work as well like that.  I think the physical blu-ray is the right format for what he's created and for me sitting reading and relaxing reading it in the lounge on the television adds something that a pure computer based project would lose.  As its like a book or glossy magazine you can dip in and out of, having it on the TV, being able to go make a drink or help the kids with their homework then come back and watch some more.  It will always be there available to read unlike websites that come and go regularly.


One of the powerful things I find about the content is just imagining some of the suitations that Mr_Lou is describing, the scenery and the settings in your own mind about what it would have been like to be there, and also taking you back to some of your own experiences and memories, it has jogged a few things in my own mind that I hadn't thought about for a long time.  While reading it I've had my interest sparked by a number of games and went off and found one to try out while reading it, and lots more to find now.  The disc have some very relaxing background music playing along which helps to build an easy and relaxing feeling to the whole thing and it can sit on in the background ready to read a little more.


I haven't finished testing, it but I'm enjoying the content, definately get behind the project if you can and if you do I hope you enjoy it like I've been.

Offline mr_lou

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Re: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?
« Reply #11 on: 18:59, 24 September 17 »
Thanks to all who has voted. And thanks to tjohnson for that awesome early review-like feedback.  :)

The betatest phase is going well. I've gotten a lot of feedback and made changes accordingly.

And still looking very much forward to completing this project!  :)

Offline mr_lou

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Time for a small status update, and I thought I'd do it in this thread now.

We're very close to the finish line, and it feels awesome. I have received a lot of great betatester feedback, everything from spelling errors to device-specific bugs and suggestions for additional functionality. (A Blu-ray player is essentially just a computer, and they each come with their own set of bugs). Bugs has been fixed, spelling errors corrected and additional functionality has been added.


It's not all good news though:

I've had to cut 11 of my own Amstrad CPC tracks from the project, due to a scare I got in relation to another project I've also been working on.
I recently video-filmed different parts of a local town-festival. Parades in the streets, amusementpark rides on the fairground, and clips from the concerts. Then learned I had to have a permission to publish this on YouTube due to the music played by the parade guards + music coming from the amusementpark rides + of course music from the concerts. Because the 3-hour long video had music playing in some form half of the time, Nordic Copyright Bureau wanted me to pay them 5.414,28 Euro for the permission to publish it on YouTube, which of course is absolutely insane.
Even if I just wanted to create a DVD or Blu-ray disc with the video and give it away to the local historic archive, they still wanted me to pay them 3.788,35 Euro...
I obviously don't have that kind of money for a simple videoproject like that.

This scared me, because 8-bit Memoirs contained 91 tracks of background music. 11 of which are made by various artists of IndieGameMusic.com, and then 80 tracks created by me on my Amstrad CPC and my Amiga back in the day. We're talking a background music playlist of 5 hours here.
But 11 of these Amstrad CPC tracks weren't originally created by me. We're talking tracks like "The Model" by Kraftwerk. "Listen to your heart" by Roxette. And "Can't touch this" by MC Hammer. Nothing close to great versions, as they're all just done in BASIC by me back in those good old days. But seeing these crazy prices from NCB, for background music covered with lots of noise, I simply dare not risk it, so I had to remove these tracks from the project, so that it only contains my own compositions + the onces from IGM.

And I've also had to write a mail to all artists who've contributed with a track too, and ask for confirmation that it is in fact their own track and that it is 100% royaltyfree.

So this means the playlist so far went form 91 tracks to 80 tracks. Still waiting to receive a confirmation from a few artists of IGM, so it might be more.


But apart from that mess, things are going good.  :)
« Last Edit: 08:47, 29 October 17 by mr_lou »

Offline tjohnson

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Time for a small status update, and I thought I'd do it in this thread now.

We're very close to the finish line, and it feels awesome. I have received a lot of great betatester feedback, everything from spelling errors to device-specific bugs and suggestions for additional functionality. (A Blu-ray player is essentially just a computer, and they each come with their own set of bugs). Bugs has been fixed, spelling errors corrected and additional functionality has been added.


It's not all good news though:

I've had to cut 11 of my own Amstrad CPC tracks from the project, due to a scare I got in relation to another project I've also been working on.
I recently video-filmed different parts of a local town-festival. Parades in the streets, amusementpark rides on the fairground, and clips from the concerts. Then learned I had to have a permission to publish this on YouTube due to the music played by the parade guards + music coming from the amusementpark rides + of course music from the concerts. Because the 3-hour long video had music playing in some form half of the time, Nordic Copyright Bureau wanted me to pay them 5.414,28 Euro for the permission to publish it on YouTube, which of course is absolutely insane.
Even if I just wanted to create a DVD or Blu-ray disc with the video and give it away to the local historic archive, they still wanted me to pay them 3.788,35 Euro...
I obviously don't have that kind of money for a simple videoproject like that.

This scared me, because 8-bit Memoirs contained 91 tracks of background music. 11 of which are made by various artists of IndieGameMusic.com, and then 80 tracks created by me on my Amstrad CPC and my Amiga back in the day. We're talking a background music playlist of 5 hours here.
But 11 of these Amstrad CPC tracks weren't originally created by me. We're talking tracks like "The Model" by Kraftwerk. "Listen to your heart" by Roxette. And "Can't touch this" by MC Hammer. Nothing close to great versions, as they're all just done in BASIC by me back in those good old days. But seeing these crazy prices from NCB, for background music covered with lots of noise, I simply dare not risk it, so I had to remove these tracks from the project, so that it only contains my own compositions + the onces from IGM.

And I've also had to write a mail to all artists who've contributed with a track too, and ask for confirmation that it is in fact their own track and that it is 100% royaltyfree.

So this means the playlist so far went form 91 tracks to 80 tracks. Still waiting to receive a confirmation from a few artists of IGM, so it might be more.


But apart from that mess, things are going good.  :)
That seems completely insane but perhaps due to music moving away from physical sales to streaming and licensing this is the only way for artists to make real money anymore.  Looking forward to the final release.

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Offline mr_lou

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That seems completely insane but perhaps due to music moving away from physical sales to streaming and licensing this is the only way for artists to make real money anymore.  Looking forward to the final release.

You've always had to pay if you wanted to use someone else's music in your videos. Like if you make video for YouTube, and you mix in a song by Taylor Swift. That's not legal to do without permission.
I wouldn't want someone to use my music without permission either.

But that's not what I've done either. What I've done is record a video of a particular amusement at a fairground, which happened to play a song by Taylor Swift, so obviously the microphone in my camera caught this song on the audio as well as all the noise and people laughing and screaming. I did not think you had to pay for that. But according to NCB I do.
And when the rules are really that strict, I dare not have any copyright tracks in 8-bit Memoirs, even if it is just an amateur Amstrad CPC chiptune version of it.

Mr.Lou's advice: "If avoidable, don't let crazy people ruin your project".

Offline mr_lou

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Re: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?
« Reply #15 on: 20:35, 18 November 17 »
Less than 2 weeks till December.  8) Can you feel the CPC Christmas spirit approaching?  :)

I've begun making copies of 8-bit Memoirs, and will be taking pre-orders now.

Anyone interested in a "full version" (i.e. the Blu-ray Disc with printed label and cover in a case), please send a PM with your name and address and also the e-mail address you use for Paypal. Then send 17 Euro to paypal@lublu.dk (obviously from the Paypal address you gave me in your PM).

(The guy who is interested in the USB version may also send me a PM with the same info. Send 23 Euro to paypal@lublu.dk).

Then I'll start preparing envelopes.  :) And you will be among the first to receive a copy.

Thank you very much for your support!

Offline mr_lou

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Re: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?
« Reply #16 on: 19:36, 22 November 17 »
Bad news for those who wants the download version:

VLC is buggy as shit.

Things that actually used to work in older nightly builds of VLC, now suddenly don't work anymore. I discovered this shortly after having created a lot of copies already, complete with print and everything.
I couldn't accept that, so I began finding workarounds for some of these bugs, but I can't fix all of them.
The worst one is when the background music changes tracks, then the whole app disappears. The only workaround for the user at this point is to pause the music (with space key). That way you can keep browsing the stories without suddenly being interrupted - but you'll obviously lose the background music.

I may end up recommending a certain version of VLC nightly builds, but I'll have to spend a lot of time testing different versions. Currently I know that one from 13th of June 2016 works semi ok. It changes tracks without killing the app - but it does go away for a second, then comes back.

During development of 8-bit Memoirs I've tried offering my help to the VLC developers with BD-J implementation, but they just don't seem that interested. They've also been rather skeptical about my input. Like e.g. when I tried explaining that Blu-ray remote controls have both a "TOP MENU" button and a "POPUP MENU" button...  I just got "That makes no sense" back, and that was it.

VLC is very limited regarding BD-J features - but I've developed 8-bit Memoirs so that it should be usable with VLC nevertheless. Except of course any new nightly build may introduce new bugs that I haven't thought of.

If possible, I strongly recommend that you get yourself PowerDVD instead.


I have to create new copies now, but I'm out of discs. Have ordered some and they're on their way. Pre-orders will be delayed, sorry.

Offline CraigsBar

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Re: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?
« Reply #17 on: 05:07, 23 November 17 »
Great work. Having spent some time with the beta release of this disc, I can confirm a great read. It's interesting to learn that cpc (and other)systems had an important part in people's lives. It even sent me off to try various games and emulators.

Good fun and an interesting way of losing an hour or two with a blu-ray player remote in your hand.

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Offline mr_lou

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Re: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?
« Reply #18 on: 10:18, 23 November 17 »
Great work. Having spent some time with the beta release of this disc, I can confirm a great read. It's interesting to learn that cpc (and other)systems had an important part in people's lives. It even sent me off to try various games and emulators.

That's awesome. Glad you like it.  :)

Good fun and an interesting way of losing an hour or two with a blu-ray player remote in your hand.

You don't mean to say you got through it all in just a few hours? Surely there must be stuff left you haven't read yet then?

Offline CraigsBar

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Re: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?
« Reply #19 on: 11:48, 23 November 17 »
That's awesome. Glad you like it.  :)

You don't mean to say you got through it all in just a few hours? Surely there must be stuff left you haven't read yet then?
Of course I did not read it in 2 hours. But I have read it (no not all) in 2 hourly chunks. That is about the limit of how long I can read from a TV screen.

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Offline mr_lou

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Re: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?
« Reply #20 on: 11:53, 23 November 17 »
Of course I did not read it in 2 hours. But I have read it (no not all) in 2 hourly chunks. That is about the limit of how long I can read from a TV screen.

Aah, like that.

Yes, I agree. I think 2 hours is max for me in a row too.  :)

Offline mr_lou

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Re: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?
« Reply #21 on: 13:40, 27 November 17 »
Alright.

Getting ready to upload the whole thing.

Gotta ask this one:

25 gb will most likely result in a timeout, so I'm gonna split it up into multiple smaller files.

What would you prefer here?

 25 files each 951 mb?
 20 files each 1,1 gb?
 16 files each 1,49 gb?
 10 files each 2,4 gb?
 8 files each 2,9 gb?
 5 files each 4,7 gb?

I have no clue how big files can get before running into timeout issues. Anyone has a clue about that?

Offline tjohnson

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Re: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?
« Reply #22 on: 21:45, 27 November 17 »
Bit torrent?

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Offline Targhan

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Re: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?
« Reply #23 on: 23:59, 27 November 17 »
Yup, it's better to use torrents.

Offline mr_lou

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Re: Which version of 8-bit Memoirs issue #1 do you expect to get?
« Reply #24 on: 07:49, 28 November 17 »
There'll also be a torrent download. It'll just take a little while though, because it's handled by SceneSat.com and they need to download from my webhotel first.

Then I hope lots of people will help make it available on the torrents.

Meanwhile, people are telling me that this whole "25 gb will timeout" isn't true, so I may just try to upload the whole file and see how it goes.