Author Topic: Joypads for under $5 (to be modded for GX4000/2 fire button joypads)  (Read 4264 times)

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Offline emuola

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Additional Gamepad Controller for SKU 28970 - Free Shipping - DealExtreme
I jus replicated a message from msx.org here. Have converted 2 pads for my msx (also has 2 fire buttons) and they work great. You really can't beat the price!
« Last Edit: 21:26, 07 May 12 by emuola »
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

Offline Gryzor

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Heh... €4. Gotta love DX. Care posting some modding instructions?

Offline emuola

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Heh... €4. Gotta love DX. Care posting some modding instructions?

Here's the original guide with very good pictures etc from a Finnish MSX guru NYYRIKKI :) It's for MSX joysticks. AFAIK the pinouts for MSX joystick and Amstrad joystick are the same.


NOTE! I havent' tested my modded on my 6128+ yet!

MSX Joypads for <  USD including shipping! | MSX Resource Center
MSX Joypads for <  USD including shipping! | MSX Resource Center
« Last Edit: 20:31, 08 May 12 by emuola »
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

Offline Bryce

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That's the "Atari Standard" pinout, it should work fine on a CPC.

Bryce.

Offline emuola

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That's the "Atari Standard" pinout, it should work fine on a CPC.

Bryce.

Yes, that's true :) What I meant was that there should be no problems in the "electrical side of things" also. I read somewhere that for example Amiga mouse/joystick (that also has the Atari standard connector) has +5V out on one of the pins. So if you hook up an Amiga mouse to let's say Msx, you could get some damage? I don't know if it's true, but from the Amiga pinout it seems to be possible?

Code: [Select]
1   V-pulse   n/c   /FORWARD   BUTTON 3   IN   
   2   H-pulse   n/c   /BACK   n/c   IN   
   3   VQ-pulse   n/c   /LEFT   BUTTON 1   IN   
   4   HQ-pulse   n/c   /RIGHT   BUTTON 2   IN   
   5   BUTTON 3(M)   Penpress   n/c   PotX   IN/OUT   
   6   BUTTON 1(L)   /Beamtrigger   /BUTTON 1   n/c   IN/OUT   
   7   +5V   +5V   +5V   +5V   OUT   50 mA max    8   GND   GND   GND   GND   
 
   9   BUTTON 2(R)   BUTTON 2   BUTTON 2   PotY   IN/OUT 
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

Offline Bryce

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An Amiga Mouse wouldn't damage the MSX, it just wouldn't work.

Bryce.

Offline emuola

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An Amiga Mouse wouldn't damage the MSX, it just wouldn't work.

Bryce.

Ok, thanks for clarifying that :) I found the statement I referrred to earlier: "Warning: Pin 5 is +5V on MSX and Mouse Button 2 on Amiga. Since Amiga mousebutton is active low, connecting an Amiga mouse to a MSX and pressing mousebutton 2 will shortcut the supply voltage."

Is this total bs? Or is it just that it actually does not matter?Sorry for being such a moron with electronics here.
« Last Edit: 14:16, 09 May 12 by emuola »
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

Offline Bryce

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Oh, if that's the case, you might have a Reset Button "feature" :D It shouldn't damage the MSX really, but it would reset the MSX and possibly damage the MSX Power supply if you held the button down for a long time.

Bryce.



Offline emuola

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Oh, if that's the case, you might have a Reset Button "feature" :D It shouldn't damage the MSX really, but it would reset the MSX and possibly damage the MSX Power supply if you held the button down for a long time.

Bryce.

Ok, thanks  for the explanation Bryce :)
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

Offline emuola

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Just tested these babies with my Plus and noticed something weird. The pads work great (both fire buttons work properly) for example with Burnin rubber (originally a GX4000/Plus game), but for example Turrican 2 wont do anything with these pads (the character won't move and fire buttons do not work either). If I change the joypad to a standard Competition Pro (only one fire button), the Turrican works ok. Is this something that has been documented or is this something new?
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

Offline Badstarr

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That does seem a bit strange, can you try Turrican 2 with the same pad on a standard CPC if you have one available? I think this may have something to do with the diodes on the Plus/GX joystick ports and the design of your new controller not playing nice with them but Bryce may have a better idea of what is going on, I'm sure he will be along soon to offer an explanation  :)
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Offline emuola

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Unfortunately I don't have access to a standard cpc. Let's wait for Bryce :)
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

Offline Bryce

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And I don't have one of these controllers. Does anyone have a schematic of what's inside them, then I can see why it's not doing what it should.

Bryce.

Offline emuola

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Unfortunately no schemas here :( The pcb is really simple, there's only one "component", the black round "blob" ;D

msx.fi/temp/joypad/7.jpg

Is there any other way to solve this than send one to you Bryce? :)
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

Offline Bryce

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I don't think there's much I could do without having one to measure. If you really want to getting it working, someone should send me one.

Bryce.

Offline emuola

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The problem is that these pads are not too robust, so I'd prefer something else in the long run. This was just an easy way out to get 2button pads for msx erally quick :) I've been toying with an idea to actually build a 2-fire button joystick from aracade machine parts like this Finnish guy did fo MSX (sorry, in Finnish):

V2.fi | Artikkeli | Puuhanurkka: 2-nappinen joystick

Also it would be great to mod a few Competition Pros for Amstrad/msx. They have 4 buttons, but of course they're all wired to the same pin and there's not even a wire inside the lead to connect the "extra button". So, this would require to change the lead to a new one.

Let's see what I'm gonna do about this ;)
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

Offline Bryce

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Well it's very easy to add an extra button to a standard Joystick without building a whole new one. The Competition Pro even already has two buttons, but they are wired in parallel, so you just need to re-wire the second button. That's what I did.

Competition Pro Joystick - blau/silber - z.B Amiga, Atari,C64,Amstrad, Schneider

Joystick Competition Pro in Grün/Silber - DAUERFEUER - | eBay

Joystick Competition Pro blau / silber ** WORKING ** [D4] | eBay

Bryce.
« Last Edit: 12:11, 25 May 12 by Bryce »

Offline ralferoo

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Annoyingly the seller seems to have not got any more on ebay, but judging by his username I'm sure they'll come back. In any case, these look excellent if you're in the UK: ARCADE MACHINE 2 X JOYSTICKS &amp; 16 BUTTONS SET MAME JAMMA 60 IN 1 | eBay
ARCADE MACHINE 2 X JOYSTICKS & 16 BUTTONS SET MAME JAMMA 60 IN 1 | eBay (expired auction)

Offline emuola

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Quote
The Competition Pro even already has two buttons, but they are wired in parallel, so you just need to re-wire the second button. That's what I did.
Ok, I'll open one of my sticks and see what it looks like there :)
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

Offline emuola

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Modding a Competition Pro 9000 (the Speedlink re-release version) to a 2-button one was really easy even for a total electronics noobie like me :) Works great!
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

Offline Bryce

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Cool. Let the gaming begin! :)

Bryce.

Offline endangermice

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What I find curious is the presence of the IC since the Atari 9 pin port doesn't need anything more than switches to connect the correct pins to ground unless the ic is for some sort or autofire feature...? I can't think of any reason wh the direction controls wouldn't work on a cpc unless the ic is doing something funky....
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Offline Badstarr

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Maybe it's working as a sort of de-bounce circuit? In other words its cleaning up the transition between on/off so that there are two clear states. If it does this too quickly I could imagine it may cause some weird behaviour depending on how a games code scans the keyboard. I had a rather destroyed joystick I think its one of those cruiser ones but I'll have to check, it had a small circuit that I presume was a rapid fire circuit and this was causing a problem on my 464 Plus and my GX machine where fire would be very hit and miss. The solution, rather than mess around I simply removed it and wired the fire buttons (well in reality there was only one) up direct. Problem solved.
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Offline Bryce

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The IC is there because the buttons aren't real contacts, they only let a tiny current through. The IC detects this and sends a proper 5V signal to the port.

Bryce.