Joypads for under $5 (to be modded for GX4000/2 fire button joypads)

Started by emuola, 19:22, 07 May 12

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emuola

Additional Gamepad Controller for SKU 28970 - Free Shipping - DealExtreme
I jus replicated a message from msx.org here. Have converted 2 pads for my msx (also has 2 fire buttons) and they work great. You really can't beat the price!
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

Gryzor

Heh... €4. Gotta love DX. Care posting some modding instructions?

emuola

Quote from: Gryzor on 15:32, 08 May 12
Heh... €4. Gotta love DX. Care posting some modding instructions?

Here's the original guide with very good pictures etc from a Finnish MSX guru NYYRIKKI :) It's for MSX joysticks. AFAIK the pinouts for MSX joystick and Amstrad joystick are the same.


NOTE! I havent' tested my modded on my 6128+ yet!

MSX Joypads for <  USD including shipping! | MSX Resource Center
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

Bryce

That's the "Atari Standard" pinout, it should work fine on a CPC.

Bryce.

emuola

Quote from: Bryce on 23:20, 08 May 12
That's the "Atari Standard" pinout, it should work fine on a CPC.

Bryce.

Yes, that's true :) What I meant was that there should be no problems in the "electrical side of things" also. I read somewhere that for example Amiga mouse/joystick (that also has the Atari standard connector) has +5V out on one of the pins. So if you hook up an Amiga mouse to let's say Msx, you could get some damage? I don't know if it's true, but from the Amiga pinout it seems to be possible?


1   V-pulse   n/c   /FORWARD   BUTTON 3   IN   
   2   H-pulse   n/c   /BACK   n/c   IN   
   3   VQ-pulse   n/c   /LEFT   BUTTON 1   IN   
   4   HQ-pulse   n/c   /RIGHT   BUTTON 2   IN   
   5   BUTTON 3(M)   Penpress   n/c   PotX   IN/OUT   
   6   BUTTON 1(L)   /Beamtrigger   /BUTTON 1   n/c   IN/OUT   
   7   +5V   +5V   +5V   +5V   OUT   50 mA max    8   GND   GND   GND   GND   
 
   9   BUTTON 2(R)   BUTTON 2   BUTTON 2   PotY   IN/OUT 
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

Bryce

An Amiga Mouse wouldn't damage the MSX, it just wouldn't work.

Bryce.

emuola

Quote from: Bryce on 09:25, 09 May 12
An Amiga Mouse wouldn't damage the MSX, it just wouldn't work.

Bryce.

Ok, thanks for clarifying that :) I found the statement I referrred to earlier: "Warning: Pin 5 is +5V on MSX and Mouse Button 2 on Amiga. Since Amiga mousebutton is active low, connecting an Amiga mouse to a MSX and pressing mousebutton 2 will shortcut the supply voltage."

Is this total bs? Or is it just that it actually does not matter?Sorry for being such a moron with electronics here.
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

Bryce

Oh, if that's the case, you might have a Reset Button "feature" :D It shouldn't damage the MSX really, but it would reset the MSX and possibly damage the MSX Power supply if you held the button down for a long time.

Bryce.



emuola

Quote from: Bryce on 12:37, 09 May 12
Oh, if that's the case, you might have a Reset Button "feature" :D It shouldn't damage the MSX really, but it would reset the MSX and possibly damage the MSX Power supply if you held the button down for a long time.

Bryce.

Ok, thanks  for the explanation Bryce :)
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

emuola

Just tested these babies with my Plus and noticed something weird. The pads work great (both fire buttons work properly) for example with Burnin rubber (originally a GX4000/Plus game), but for example Turrican 2 wont do anything with these pads (the character won't move and fire buttons do not work either). If I change the joypad to a standard Competition Pro (only one fire button), the Turrican works ok. Is this something that has been documented or is this something new?
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

Badstarr

That does seem a bit strange, can you try Turrican 2 with the same pad on a standard CPC if you have one available? I think this may have something to do with the diodes on the Plus/GX joystick ports and the design of your new controller not playing nice with them but Bryce may have a better idea of what is going on, I'm sure he will be along soon to offer an explanation  :)
Proud owner of 464 GTM64 6128 GTM65, GX4128 and a 464/6128 Plus Hybrid a 20 year long ambition realised! :-)

emuola

Unfortunately I don't have access to a standard cpc. Let's wait for Bryce :)
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

Bryce

And I don't have one of these controllers. Does anyone have a schematic of what's inside them, then I can see why it's not doing what it should.

Bryce.

emuola

Unfortunately no schemas here :( The pcb is really simple, there's only one "component", the black round "blob" ;D

msx.fi/temp/joypad/7.jpg

Is there any other way to solve this than send one to you Bryce? :)
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

Bryce

I don't think there's much I could do without having one to measure. If you really want to getting it working, someone should send me one.

Bryce.

emuola

The problem is that these pads are not too robust, so I'd prefer something else in the long run. This was just an easy way out to get 2button pads for msx erally quick :) I've been toying with an idea to actually build a 2-fire button joystick from aracade machine parts like this Finnish guy did fo MSX (sorry, in Finnish):

V2.fi | Artikkeli | Puuhanurkka: 2-nappinen joystick

Also it would be great to mod a few Competition Pros for Amstrad/msx. They have 4 buttons, but of course they're all wired to the same pin and there's not even a wire inside the lead to connect the "extra button". So, this would require to change the lead to a new one.

Let's see what I'm gonna do about this ;)
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

Bryce

Well it's very easy to add an extra button to a standard Joystick without building a whole new one. The Competition Pro even already has two buttons, but they are wired in parallel, so you just need to re-wire the second button. That's what I did.

Competition Pro Joystick - blau/silber - z.B Amiga, Atari,C64,Amstrad, Schneider

Joystick Competition Pro in Grün/Silber - DAUERFEUER - | eBay

Joystick Competition Pro blau / silber ** WORKING ** [D4] | eBay

Bryce.

ralferoo

Annoyingly the seller seems to have not got any more on ebay, but judging by his username I'm sure they'll come back. In any case, these look excellent if you're in the UK: ARCADE MACHINE 2 X JOYSTICKS & 16 BUTTONS SET MAME JAMMA 60 IN 1 | eBay (expired auction)

emuola

QuoteThe Competition Pro even already has two buttons, but they are wired in parallel, so you just need to re-wire the second button. That's what I did.
Ok, I'll open one of my sticks and see what it looks like there :)
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

emuola

Modding a Competition Pro 9000 (the Speedlink re-release version) to a 2-button one was really easy even for a total electronics noobie like me :) Works great!
Amstrad CPC 6128+ and internal HxC floppy emulator

Bryce


endangermice

What I find curious is the presence of the IC since the Atari 9 pin port doesn't need anything more than switches to connect the correct pins to ground unless the ic is for some sort or autofire feature...? I can't think of any reason wh the direction controls wouldn't work on a cpc unless the ic is doing something funky....
For all the latest Starquake remake news check out my website - www.endangermice.co.uk

Badstarr

Maybe it's working as a sort of de-bounce circuit? In other words its cleaning up the transition between on/off so that there are two clear states. If it does this too quickly I could imagine it may cause some weird behaviour depending on how a games code scans the keyboard. I had a rather destroyed joystick I think its one of those cruiser ones but I'll have to check, it had a small circuit that I presume was a rapid fire circuit and this was causing a problem on my 464 Plus and my GX machine where fire would be very hit and miss. The solution, rather than mess around I simply removed it and wired the fire buttons (well in reality there was only one) up direct. Problem solved.
Proud owner of 464 GTM64 6128 GTM65, GX4128 and a 464/6128 Plus Hybrid a 20 year long ambition realised! :-)

Bryce

The IC is there because the buttons aren't real contacts, they only let a tiny current through. The IC detects this and sends a proper 5V signal to the port.

Bryce.

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