Megaflash - which ROMs?

[TFM]

Thank's for compling the list!!! Yes better 2-3 disc's 

I'll copy & paste that 

[SyX]

Good Morning!!! 

Terje, you have forgotten the last rom in appears and one of the best ... QuickCMD!!! 

[Bryce]

41-BUNNYDOS V1.72

You can remember that many ROMs from memory, but you can't count to 40?

Yes QuickCMD should definitely be there, but with modern ROMs you will have to regularly update the disc when newer versions are released. With old ROMs this obviously isn't a problem.

According to my ROM Database, there are only around 60 ROMs in total at the moment, so you may as well just include them all.

Bryce.

[Cholo]

I assume everyone who ordered a Megaflash is probably searching for amstrad roms. A while back i downloaded every rom i could get from a emulator site (one at a time of cause). To save everyone else a bit of time ive uploaded all 76 of em in one "Planetemu" pack here (next to my old original dumps):

http://www.4shared.com/folder/YFMvbdqW/ROM.html

Do note that some of them are either internal hardware roms or need hardware in some other way and so wont work with the Megaflash.

[Bryce]

Cool idea. Thanks.

Bryce.

[Terje_Norway]

Hi 

You can remember that many ROMs from memory, but you can't count to 40?

Yes, I agree I miscalculated a bit. Only exceeded the 'budget' with 2.5 %, that should actually be accepted in Europa in these days.
Greece, Spain, Portugal, Italy and Ireland are exceeding their budgets with a much worse ratio than I did 

Yes QuickCMD should definitely be there, but with modern ROMs you will have to regularly update the disc when newer versions are released. With old ROMs this obviously isn't a problem.

According to my ROM Database, there are only around 60 ROMs in total at the moment, so you may as well just include them all.

I have searched my PC harddrive, and I seems to have found 129 ROMs. I have picked out the system ROMs and duplicates, and ended up with a list of over 100 ROMs. This list probably contains more duplicates than those I have spotted, but have a look at it :
(YES, I know several of them refers specific hardware, and would be useless with the Megaflash  )


720KAMSD.ROM
Addon1.rom
Addon2.rom
AksROMv10.rom
AMRAM2.ROM
AMSPAT++.ROM
arcs16.rom
BAS-CHE.ROM
bcpl.rom
BDOS172.ROM
BOOSTER.ROM
BOS21.ROM
CAGE1.ROM
cage11.rom
CAGE2.ROM
COMSTAR1.ROM
COMSTAR2.ROM
COPYL60.ROM
copymatp.rom
CPC X-DDos v2.10 (1990)(Dobbertin).rom
cpm1.rom
cpm2.rom
cpmacc1.rom
CPMCRCH.ROM
dbreed1.rom
DDEMON.ROM
des1.rom
des2.rom
DISCFILE.ROM
discpowe.rom
DKSPEECH.ROM
DOLOGY6.ROM
DOSCRIME.ROM
exbasic.rom
fbasic.rom
flteprm.rom
HACKEUR.ROM
jlutilit.rom
jmpeprm.rom
KNSROM.ROM
KSERIAL.ROM
LOCKS.ROM
MAGIC.ROM
MAIL.ROM
mastsave.rom
maxam.rom
MAXAM150.ROM
MFILE128.ROM
MFILE464.ROM
MMC1.ROM
MMC2.ROM
MULTFACE.ROM
MUZAK.ROM
NIGDOS.ROM
NIRVANA.ROM
nwcutili.rom
ODDJOB22.ROM
parados.rom
piadr.rom
promerge.rom
proskey.rom
prospell.rom
protext.rom
protexth.rom
pt12a.rom
rdosxl40.rom
rdosxl48.rom
rob3rom.rom
RODOS211.ROM
RODOS215.ROM
ROMDOS.ROM
ROMDOSXL.ROM
sbasic.rom
SB-D-127.ROM
SILIDISC.ROM
SNArkosv14.rom
soundtr1.rom
soundtr2.rom
starkos1.rom
starkos2.rom
starkosg.rom
STYLE.ROM
SUPER.ROM
Sym-RomA.ROM
Sym-RomB.ROM
Sym-RomC.ROM
Sym-RomD.ROM
SYSX21.ROM
T3MROM.ROM
TMAT21.ROM
TOOLBOX.ROM
TOOLKIT.ROM
UTILITY.ROM
utopia.rom
vdos20.rom
vdos211.rom
vdos211x.rom
VORTEX20.ROM
vortramd.rom
VRAMID.ROM
XDDOS111.ROM
XROM.ROM


I'll also include the following ROMs :

FutureOS (Rom A,B,C & D)
QuickCMD
HxC ROM


Any more ROMs I have missed ? ? ?


Yours


Terje Grind
NORWAY

[Bryce]

Great list! Some of the Hardware specific ROMs aren't as useless as you might think though. If you own for example the disc based version of the DKTronics speechSynth, you can install the Speech ROM on the MegaFlash and it will work there too, enhancing your existing Hardware. There were several other expansions, that also had a low-cost disc-based version like this that can be enhanced in the same way.

Bryce.

[norecess]

Actually, an installed ROM without documentation is useless.. (cf. which RSX to call ?).


Keep that in mind,... because most of those ROMs are useless, as we don't know how to use them.

[TFM]

Just use the !HELP command of MAXAM.

!HELP,rom will display all RSX of the rom.

However, good point, so documentation shall be included.

[Cholo]

Indeed, the Utopia rom has the same command too.

Like if you want to know the RSX in rom no. 6 you type:
|HELP,6
and you get the names.
In half the roms its probably enough just having the name(s) as its just used to load the main programs interface. Of cause with the "basic extending" roms you really need manuals to get to know they work.
Also probably a good idea to test any rom combination in Winape first as some roms have very specifik rules on where they need to go to work with others.

[norecess]

Bouncing back on Terje post, where can we download all those ROMs ? (url..). Is that available on the wiki ?


Otherwise, how do you manage your "roms on dsk" on the CPC ? I advise using a huge 80-sector single-sided format (Parados) and put all .ROM files on it... instead of always switching through your disc / disc images.

[Carnivius]

I always feel stupid coming here.  I have no idea what any of this stuff means.  The techie side of the CPC is quite beyond me no matter how much I try to understand.

[Bryce]

Hi Carnivac,
      here's a quick introductory lesson to ROMs with the important bits you need to know:

1 ) The CPC hardware is designed to (theoretically) take up to 256 external ROMs
2 ) Each ROM can be up to 16K and are numbered starting from 0.
3 ) The ROM can contain a program or utility.
4 ) The programs are started using an "RSX" command: ie: A command with the bar "|" in front - Such as |M to start Maxam.
5 ) Standard ROMBoards or the MegaFlash allow you to install these. Older ROMBoards usually only supported 6 or 8 ROMs and each ROM was an individual EPROM chip. Whereas modern versions (SF2, Inicron, RamCard, MegaROM, MegaFlash) support up to 32 ROMs and have combined several virtual ROMs within a single larger chip.
6 ) Many programs and utilities were released on ROM for three good reasons:
     A) They start instantly, because they don't actually need to be loaded.
     B) They are always present in the background and can be called/started without needing to insert a disk or tape.
         (useful for utilities such as Basic extensions or Disc utilities)
     C) They usually run directly from the ROM, not from RAM, so the RAM is still 99.9% empty.
         (useful for text editors and compilers because the RAM is free to be used for data)
7 ) The Hardware: The CPC can choose which ROM chip is associated with the 16K area starting at &C000. This is usually the reserved for the contents of the screen (RAM), but the address range is shared with ROM Memory.
On start up, the CPC checks whether any ROMs are installed. The CPC464 only checks for ROMs in positions 7-0, but the 6128 checks for ROMs in positions 15-0. (I write 15-0 because they really are scanned in the reverse order). If a ROM is present, the CPC checks what commands the ROM offers and saves them in a table in RAM (This is why I said the RAM is 99.9% free and not 100%).
8 ) There are two special ROM positions: ROM 0 is reserved for Basic (known as a type &80 ROM), ROM 7 is reserved for the Disc Operating System - Not present on a 464, AMSDOS on a 6128.
9 ) The CPC464 has one internal ROM (0) which can be overwritten by a ROMBoard to replace Basic. The 6128 has internal ROMs 0 and 7 (0 can be overwritten but not 7). The CPC Plus series can overwrite both 0 and 7.
10 ) The Plus CPCs don't have internal ROMs, it was "out-sourced" to the Cartridge. The cartridge is actually situated in ROM positions 128 onwards, but the ASIC in the Plus re-maps the cartridge ROMs to 0 and 7 for compatibility.

Any further questions - ask away...
Any corrects, mistakes, let me know?

Bryce.

Edit: Before I get corrected, yes there IS another ROM inside the CPC. The Firmware ROM is also present in all CPCs, but this gets mapped to a different area of memory and also doesn't have a ROM Number. It's also possible to overwrite this ROM externally, however most ROMBoards can't do this (as far as I know).

[Carnivius]

Oh ok.  So this be why emulated games from cartridge based consoles are referred to as roms?  Cos a rom is a like a cartridge game and you can plug in what you want or need and they because they are more like memory packs than discs or cassettes they appear to load instantly.  I think I sorta get it and I can see the advantages.

[Bryce]

Well programs on a disc or tape are saved in a specific format to suit the media. ROMs are just like physical memory, so the raw data needs no conversion. Inside a cartridge there's also just a ROM chip, exactly like the ones seen one a ROMBoard.

You can see the individual physical ROMs in this picture of a standard ROMBoard:
http://www.cpcwiki.eu/index.php/File:Rom_Expander.jpg

The single ROM inside a cartridge:
http://www.cpcwiki.eu/imgs/f/f7/Cartridge-PT-NO-Z90903-MS0201A-Installed.jpg

And the combined ROM of the MegaFlash (the small square at the back is a 512K ROM split into 16K chunks)
http://www.cpcwiki.eu/index.php/File:MegaFlash_Final.jpg

Bryce.

[Gryzor]

Well, the "ROM" term has prevailed from the days when the games images were actually ROM dumps from arcade boards. Now many people call every image - be it a disk image, a tape image or what have you - a ROM. But yeah, technically it's correct to call these "ROMs".

@Bryce: excellent summary! Can I add it to http://www.cpcwiki.eu/index.php/Category:Expansion_ROM ?

@Terje, Cholo, norecess: these packs would be awfully nice to include in the Megaflash page...

@Terje: Balanced budgets are not always the way to go. Of course, it's always about *how* you use the money (yes, I know you were just kidding!).

[Bryce]

Yeah, sure, add it wherever you like.

Do we have a ROMs section (like the games section: http://www.cpcwiki.eu/index.php/Games) anywhere on the Wiki? It would be handy to have the description there, with a list of all know ROMs beneath and a seperate page for each ROM (again like the games with Author / Year / reviews etc)

Bryce.

[Gryzor]

Yeah, sure, add it wherever you like.

Do we have a ROMs section (like the games section: http://www.cpcwiki.eu/index.php/Games) anywhere on the Wiki? It would be handy to have the description there, with a list of all know ROMs beneath and a seperate page for each ROM (again like the games with Author / Year / reviews etc)

Bryce.

Well, I had this in mind: http://www.cpcwiki.eu/index.php/Category:Expansion_ROM . But no games (yet)... maybe we should.

[Bryce]

Well Terjes list could be used as a starting point (possibly sorted into catagories - Utility / Compiler / Basic Extension) for the list, then we just need to link the ROM names to any existing ROM pages (maxam/utopia etc). The description (with some editing) could be put as an intro at the top of the page.

Bryce.

[TFM]

Otherwise, how do you manage your "roms on dsk" on the CPC ? I advise using a huge 80-sector single-sided format (Parados) and put all .ROM files on it... instead of always switching through your disc / disc images.

Hehe! Well, that's waht I do. I got five Discs of 0.7 MB (Vortex format) and they are stuffed with ROMs.

[Cholo]

@Terje, Cholo, norecess: these packs would be awfully nice to include in the Megaflash page...

Sure, go ahead 

Oh ok.  So this be why emulated games from cartridge based consoles are referred to as roms?  Cos a rom is a like a cartridge game and you can plug in what you want or need and they because they are more like memory packs than discs or cassettes they appear to load instantly.  I think I sorta get it and I can see the advantages.

Indeed, a rom = a chip dump. So unlike the GX4000 game roms .. the roms we talk about here is "extension" or "program" roms that dont execute automaticly. Its easy to explain if you have ever tried hooking up a extension to your amstrad .. like a SPEECH module, DDI 3" drive or a Multiface 2. All you do is smack the black box onto your amstrads port. Then turn on the amstrad and .. nothing happens .. to the naked eye. Of cause something has happened as you have gotten some more commands. Like if you added a DDI 3" drive to a 464 you will notice that you have gotten a new set of new disc commands available like |Disc, |Tape, |A and |B etc. that wasnt there before.
These "program" roms can be quite different. Some is just like a extension of Basic and you get a lot of small commands but others only have one command just to launch one large program.
Then there are the system roms that either replace (like if you want a different language keyboard) or extend functionality (like support for larger floppies).
Of cause the nice thing is the speed of it all. Even tho 3" floppies load really quickly then having a "instant" loading program from rom is really nice.

[TFM]

Well, an extension ROM can start automaticly (since I lack another example: If you place a copy of FutureOS ROM A to ROM slot 0 it will start automatically). It all depends on the software.

[Gryzor]

I assume everyone who ordered a Megaflash is probably searching for amstrad roms. A while back i downloaded every rom i could get from a emulator site (one at a time of cause). To save everyone else a bit of time ive uploaded all 76 of em in one "Planetemu" pack here (next to my old original dumps):

http://www.4shared.com/folder/YFMvbdqW/ROM.html

Do note that some of them are either internal hardware roms or need hardware in some other way and so wont work with the Megaflash.

Hey, I only see 8 files?

Btw, file uploads works again in the wiki

[Edit] Erm... I missed the zip file!
[Edit2] Hm, I can't download the zip file, it always give me a "not valid" error... could you up it someplace else? Or even send me an email?

[Gryzor]

Here my configuration:


1: RDOS (provides 444 KB RAM disc)

3: Promerge
4: Maxam
5: Protext
6: XD-DOS
7: Amsdos (parked, umparked of some games)

10: FutureOS (ROMs B,C,D at 20,21,22)

15: ROM-Booster (enables ROMs 16-31 to be expansion ROMs)

The others are filled dynamically, when needed.

You mention, in the FOS doc, that it should be installed in ROM slots 11-13. How do you do what you say?

Also, which version of the ROM Manager is specific for FOS?

[TFM]

You mention, in the FOS doc, that it should be installed in ROM slots 11-13. How do you do what you say?

Right, in a regular ROM board / ROM-RAM-card/box with 16 ROMs you just install FutureOS to &A, &B, &C and &D which is 10,11,12 and 13. Because the ROMs are hardcoded.

Now, the MegaFlash has 32 ROMs and it's an advantage to use the upper ROMs too. Only FutureOS ROM A does need a ROM number between 1 and 15. So the others can be placed anywhere else.
Now this is possible, because the new automatic Installer adapts the ROMs, so all ROM numbers can be used.

If you like a FutureOS version with special ROM numbers, just let me know and I send you the adapted intaller.

Well, at the moment the installer doesn't ask you for the ROM numbers (why bother the user with that?) It just tells you where the OS was installed.

Also, which version of the ROM Manager is specific for FOS?

Actually the MegaFlash ROManager is being developped in parallel for FutureOS and BASIC. If you download the ZIP archive, then you will find a DSK for both OS.