Author Topic: Batman Forever  (Read 74138 times)

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Offline AMSDOS

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #175 on: 11:16, 06 May 11 »

I agree totally!!!

Ditto, they can dribble on my weird and unorthodox routines or just wait until a Guest Ghost posts an Untitled Thread instead!  ;D
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Offline spybro

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #176 on: 12:27, 06 May 11 »

and enter the debate "realtime vs precalc" there. Realtimers say "that effect is only for show", while precalc'ers say "that's exactly true".



if the debate was on that axis it would have been a healthy confrontation
instead what we've seen was some holy cows (especially in another cpc gathering place)
taking up on Batman Group
the main coder Rhino was in predicament and had to go open on his approach of coding
just to explain that its not about highend technics but also presentation
Lets be realistic Rhino comes from the Amiga family so it is natural that he has his way with demomaking
on the other hand most cpc demos until recent years looked like previews only few made it over to the other side with the help of the boatman eg Sappy


But what makes a good demo?
Is it the technics it is using?Of course!(from scratch)
Is it the music?Of course!Remember Jesus on E's?
Is it the concept story?Of course!Desert Dreams
Is it the artistic design?Hell yes! State of the Art


Now if you have all these you have a huge Wow factor


If you have some of these then its only mediocre


So having the mentioned elements in your armory
will get you a 288 score on pouet


Coming back on the so called debate(it was a cannibalism for me) only led to the departure of a unique
demomaker/presentation producer from the family orientated scene of cpc


as voxfreak wrote somewhere else
Thank you Batman Group for bringing pure innovation to our scene! Respect


Offline MaV

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #177 on: 14:42, 06 May 11 »
Coming back on the so called debate(it was a cannibalism for me) only led to the departure of a unique
demomaker/presentation producer from the family orientated scene of cpc


as voxfreak wrote somewhere else
Thank you Batman Group for bringing pure innovation to our scene! Respect

One technical aspect that even C64 users in other forums did praise was the mode 2 screen where the text is written with pixel waves.

This could have been realized on a C64 as well (albeit with lower resolution and probably less pixels), it is the idea itself that was new to the 8-bit scene.

The demo has more merits, but the discussion unfortunately sticks to bland debates of coding techniques.

What's left to say?

Thank you Batman Group for bringing pure innovation to us Amstrad users! :)

MaV





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Offline HAL 6128

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #178 on: 15:28, 06 May 11 »
But what makes a good demo?
Is it the technics it is using?Of course!(from scratch)
Is it the music?Of course!Remember Jesus on E's?
Is it the concept story?Of course!Desert Dreams
Is it the artistic design?Hell yes! State of the Art

... as TFM said: it's like watching a movie. You want to be "entertained" or at least you expect it. If all criterias are "good" (for a certain kind of subjective estimation) then the demo is "good". An extended criteria for a GAME apart the criterias above could be e.g. "how good a real personen is embedded into the game".

It's difficult to talk about those criterias if there is no consistent understanding what we are talking about. It's easier to say: "The technics for that zoomscrollers have a rating of 9 out of 10 point because it's speed of calculating (fps) has reached 95% of the actual benchmark". It's more difficult to measure a criteria which based on sympathy (like the content of music).
 
Or for expample: The Demo Batman Forever used pictures (as the author said) from the designer Bob Kane (drawn characters out of the Batman comics). Those influential paintings are for the most people wonderful but should not an component to assess that demo. They are copied or at least adapted ...they has been already good before the demo was created.
Even if the used technics has already been common the Batman demo created something of how to bring lots of single stuff into one demo together (visual technics, discloader, music between, story board and so on). That's what I didn't seen in that quantity/quality before.
 
But don't waste time in talking - please generate more demos!
Or with the words of a non-coder: I want to be entertained!
(I know... lazy ass I am).
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Offline Sykobee (Briggsy)

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #179 on: 17:47, 06 May 11 »
Demos are meant to entertain and wow. Batman Forever entertained and wowed, even if it achieved that my pre-calculating data. The algorithmic interest then turns to the fast on-screen rendering implementation rather than if it's doing the maths to rotate a city or batman logo. Great demo, great that it was made, great to see the CPC put to good use. End of.

Offline trocoloco

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #180 on: 17:51, 06 May 11 »
Thank you Batman Group for bringing pure innovation to us Amstrad users! :)

Same here!

Online Gryzor

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #181 on: 20:18, 06 May 11 »

Coming back on the so called debate(it was a cannibalism for me) only led to the departure of a unique
demomaker/presentation producer from the family orientated scene of cpc


Why? Who left?


Offline einoeL

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #182 on: 23:18, 06 May 11 »
Batman Forever is the best CPC-Demo ever.
It really looks like an Amiga-Demo, the music stands out.
This Demo is a masterpiece with a funky flow.
Great entertainment.

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #183 on: 09:24, 07 May 11 »
Amen.

Offline jsa

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #184 on: 15:39, 23 May 11 »
Ummm, what exactly is amiga demo then ? I "just" got home from Streamparty VIII and we had interesting discussion there with old peeps from C64 scene and consensus was that Amiga demos really start to be more or less generic 3D flybys with music. Dunno if that is going to change as getting these accelerators for Amiga is getting harder and thus getting certain demos even running is getting tricky. Not everyone are happy how things are going, but then again it seems to be that C64 scene is more or less still active and there are more stuff coming for old breadbox... almost daily basis.

But let's see what happens in the future anyway, i suspect that more esoteric platforms are used to create demos. So there is still room for CPC as well :)

Offline Optimus

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #185 on: 16:14, 05 June 11 »
Well, the demo was compared to Amiga 16bit demos not the AGA ones.
The modern amiga demos while not having the style and dynamics of the classic Amiga demos, they might be interesting for 3d coders. Still, I prefer watching some nifty 2d effects in between the 3d scenes.
Yep, the fun is 8bit forever :)

Offline 00WReX

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #186 on: 15:19, 02 January 12 »
Hi guys,
What are you doing/using to get this demo onto your CPC's.

I have a 3.5 inch drive on the CPC but only a USB floppy on my PC so I use writedsk.

This works really well for just about everything I throw at it, but not the Batman demo.

Just noticed that ManageDSK does not like it either...

Any help Appreciated.


Cheers,
Shane
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Offline fgbrain

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #187 on: 13:19, 15 January 12 »
Here's what I did and it worked fine for me:
(I have an external 3.5" drive as well..)

1 .Downloaded this double sided version:
http://www.cpc-power.com/cpcdemos/pages/download_part.php?fiche=1756&part=Batman%20forever%20%28UK%29%20%28128K%29%20%282011%29%20%5BBatman%20group%5D%20%5BDouble%20Side%20Drive%20Version%5D.dsk
2. Used CPCDiskXP 2.1 to write to a 3.5" disk
3. Then RUN"disc on my 6128 and you're off!!!

Unfortunately, ManageDSK still doesn't support double sided DSKs..
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Offline Optimus

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #188 on: 23:22, 16 January 12 »
Just to notice that BF didn't run in my CPC if the drive is B. Needed an additional switch to see the original 3" as B and the 3.5" as A.
I have only tried to write the three separate DSK sides. Maybe I tried to copy the double sided originally and also had troubles.





Offline TFM

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #189 on: 18:51, 17 January 12 »
Just to notice that BF didn't run in my CPC if the drive is B. Needed an additional switch to see the original 3" as B and the 3.5" as A.
I have only tried to write the three separate DSK sides. Maybe I tried to copy the double sided originally and also had troubles.

Hi Optimus :-) If I understand you right, then you did manage to transfer it to 3.5". Now, you can use Discology to transfer it to 3".

This demo seems to be a pain in the aXX for some more users ;-)
TFM of FutureSoft
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Offline Devilmarkus

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #190 on: 21:01, 17 January 12 »
Well I transferred it once with JavaCPC directly to 3", had no trouble with it...
(But you need a 3" disk drive connected to your PC)
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Offline Rhino

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #191 on: 02:55, 18 January 12 »
Hi,

The demo (one disk version) should work from both A and B.
The problems with three disks version come if you have two drives but you do not insert both disks in drives as indicated in the initial message. As arnoldemu said me, this is because after the initial message, it checks if the disks are properly inserted in drives but when some drives are empty the loader does not work more after this checking process and an error message is showed in red.

Then, if you have a double sided drive you can use the one disk version (from A or B) but if you have an external single sided you must insert both disks in drives and you can execute it from B if you want, the only rule is not to have an empty drive when executing the three disks version.

If someone found some other problem, please tell me.

Online Gryzor

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #192 on: 13:23, 18 January 12 »
I thought that with USB drives you're out of luck altogether?

Offline Optimus

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #193 on: 12:55, 19 January 12 »
Well, problem is my 3" drive is not working. I had forgotten an old disk in there but I guess becuase it's not working it couldn't see the disk.

Offline 00WReX

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #194 on: 13:42, 19 January 12 »
I thought that with USB drives you're out of luck altogether?


writedsk is fine on a USB floppy (because the conversion is done on the CPC). But I think it struggles with the odd dsk. I have actually only not been able to get The Batman demo working with it out of probably a hundred dsk's.
I think I would need to use CPCdiscXP to get this working, but I don't have an IDE floppy, in fact I don't have a desktop PC at all...I ditched them for laptops years ago, so only a USB floppy for me and these don't work with the true low level floppy driver that CPCdiscXP requires.
Not really a big deal, was just wondering if I was missing something as I would like to see the demo on a real CPC.


Writedsk is really good though for anyone with only a USB floppy...

http://www.cpcwiki.eu/index.php/WriteDSK


Cheers,
Shane
The CPC in Australia...
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Offline arnoldemu

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #195 on: 13:39, 21 January 12 »
Well, problem is my 3" drive is not working. I had forgotten an old disk in there but I guess becuase it's not working it couldn't see the disk.
How is it not working? What are the symptoms?

The demo tries to read from both drives if they have a disc in them, and decides what discs you have inserted.

btw, when copying to real 3.5" or 3" discs you need to use the special version of cpcdiskxp that is used for orion prime, because the gap length is important on batman forever.
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Offline Optimus

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #196 on: 00:52, 24 January 12 »
How is it not working? What are the symptoms?

The demo tries to read from both drives if they have a disc in them, and decides what discs you have inserted.

btw, when copying to real 3.5" or 3" discs you need to use the special version of cpcdiskxp that is used for orion prime, because the gap length is important on batman forever.


My old 3" drive is not working just because I have left it to oblivion :)
I might just have to change the rubber. I was just bored to at the moment.


I was referring to the explanation from Rhino, that maybe because I didn't have disks to both sides (or really there was a 3" disk inserted but not BF and my drive wouldn't be able to read it anyway) it didn't work. But it worked when I switch the working 3.5" drive to be seen as A.


Offline SuTeKH/Epyteor

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #197 on: 22:23, 03 August 12 »
Great respect and huge congratulations to Batman Group for winning 3 awards at the 10th scene.org Awards! Also, big congratulations and respect to all the CPC-Wiki guys who helped Batman Group to create the best oldeskool demo of 2011, the most technical demo of 2011 and the public's choice demo of 2011! Top job!

Amstrad Rises!

Offline MacDeath

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #198 on: 13:51, 04 August 12 »
Quote
Great respect and huge congratulations to Batman Group for winning 3 awards at the 10th scene.org Awards! Also, big congratulations and respect to all the CPC-Wiki guys who helped Batman Group to create the best oldeskool demo of 2011, the most technical demo of 2011 and the public's choice demo of 2011!
I would like to personnally dedicate this victory to the French sceners... er... oh wait... nevermind.
 ;D




Well done España.


Also just a funny thing attached here, extract from Pouët...


lots of prizes with this only Amstrad prod.
« Last Edit: 13:56, 04 August 12 by MacDeath »

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Re: Batman Forever
« Reply #199 on: 18:12, 04 August 12 »
God damn that's right. Yeeeeeah!