Another World CPC

[Misel982001]

Hi guys....I was wondering if Another World could be made on the plain CPC or on the plus ....

[zeropolis79]

No reason why it couldn't be done.. The CPC has shown it can do rotoscoped graphics (Ghost Hunters)... Not always much on screen.

[Misel982001]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZ2OOFeW_pE&ab_channel=Xyphoe


wow I didn't remember this one....well it definitely can do it and maybe the plus range is able to deliver a port of at least in par with that of the A500.

[robcfg]

I remember playing a demo of Another World on Atari 8-bit computers, so definitely can be done.

[m_dr_m]

Hi guys....I was wondering if Another World could be made on the plain CPC or on the plus ....

Yes! A plain CPC 6128 is enough.

[zeropolis79]

One of my favourite non-CPC games - would love to see a port of it..

[eto]

The virtual machine to run Another World is only 20kb, but the performance requirements to appropriately recreate the atmosphere are probably hard to achieve on an 8bit machine. The Atari 8Bit demo is no counterexample. It replicates a few screens with background pictures and some sprites. Saying this would be a similar experience is like saying Star Wars in ASCII is a similar experience to Star Wars the movie (btw: if you haven't seen Star Wars ASCII yet, you definitely should).

Another World is not only a game but also a movie. To achieve that it requires lots of effects, that are possible on 16Bit machines like the Amiga or ST but are hard on 8Bit machines. Filled polygons and  cinematic effects like zooming and sound effects create the atmosphere. Pixel graphics and 3-channel YM sounds will be just a game similar to Prince of Persia - not necessarily bad, but not Another World.

If you need some  insights on what it requires, then I would recommend the following two sites:

http://www.anotherworld.fr/anotherworld_uk/another_world.htm

https://fabiensanglard.net/anotherWorld_code_review/index.php

[Gryzor]

Actually, I was going to say "why mention Ghost Hunters* and not PoP?". Saying that PoP on the CPC is "not necessarily bad" is an insult I think it's an excellent, very playable and very faithful port.

Yes, Another World has a few more things thrown in, sure, lots of cinematic stuff going on but I don't think it'd be impossible to cut it down to something still respectable...


*I had forgotten about this one!

[zeropolis79]

Actually, I was going to say "why mention Ghost Hunters* and not PoP?". Saying that PoP on the CPC is "not necessarily bad" is an insult I think it's an excellent, very playable and very faithful port.

Yes, Another World has a few more things thrown in, sure, lots of cinematic stuff going on but I don't think it'd be impossible to cut it down to something still respectable...


*I had forgotten about this one!

I didn't mention PoP as I didn't know if the CPC version had rotoscoped graphics. (even though that version is a beautiful one and very playable). Ghost Hunters I knew for certain.

[roudoudou]

The virtual machine to run Another World is only 20kb, but the performance requirements to appropriately recreate the atmosphere are probably hard to achieve on an 8bit machine. The Atari 8Bit demo is no counterexample. It replicates a few screens with background pictures and some sprites. Saying this would be a similar experience is like saying Star Wars in ASCII is a similar experience to Star Wars the movie (btw: if you haven't seen Star Wars ASCII yet, you definitely should).

Except that Another World Atari/Amiga is the Ascii version of the game 
So a pixel version with all animations can't be worse than the original
I check the second link you post, with the background designed with 981 polygones. As the same link says, a polygone is many bytes, even optimised and crunched afterward

So i converted the background screen to a Plus version 160x200
This is crunched in 2142 bytes with ZX0 and the decrunch is done in 0.25s, not that bad for a 8bits machine 
The Another World technical choice had sense back in the days. Not today
Anyway, convert such a game is a lot of work and i doubt someone will try to do it 

[eto]

So i converted the background screen to a Plus version 160x200

Agreed, the backgrounds are not the problem, especially with state of the art compression technology. But do you think you can do animations and sound on the CPC that is even close to what we see on the ST?

[Otto]

Another-World and the cinema-technically very similar Flashback game from the same French developers, had SNES versions. There the vector cinema seqeuences were slower than those of true 16-bit machines like Sega Megadrive (Mc68000) or Atari ST/Amiga (Mc68000), since the SNES' CPU was more like a 8-bit CPU and the SNES' sprite chips didn't help with vector graphics. Still the SNES versions were very nice.

How does the CPC's 8-bit Z80 with 4 MHz compare to the SNES's CPU with its 8-bit data bus and even less MHz? Wikipedia says:

The [SNES'] CPU is a Ricoh 5A22, which is a derivative of the 16-bit WDC 65C816 microprocessor. In NTSC regions, its nominal clock speed is 3.58 MHz but the CPU will slow down to either 2.68 MHz or 1.79 MHz when accessing some slower peripherals. ... This CPU has an 8-bit data bus and two address buses.

[Gryzor]

Except that Another World Atari/Amiga is the Ascii version of the game 
So a pixel version with all animations can't be worse than the original
I check the second link you post, with the background designed with 981 polygones. As the same link says, a polygone is many bytes, even optimised and crunched afterward

So i converted the background screen to a Plus version 160x200
This is crunched in 2142 bytes with ZX0 and the decrunch is done in 0.25s, not that bad for a 8bits machine 
The Another World technical choice had sense back in the days. Not today
Anyway, convert such a game is a lot of work and i doubt someone will try to do it 

Impressive result.

[roudoudou]

Agreed, the backgrounds are not the problem, especially with state of the art compression technology. But do you think you can do animations and sound on the CPC that is even close to what we see on the ST?

Animation is not the problem, in my point of view, even huge ones. SoundFX will be harder because it's memory/time consuming a lot

[Misel982001]

Since PRINCE OF PERSIA was running well, wouldn't it be possible that a version with still screens instead of cinematics be created on a plain cpc? If we were talking about a plus version . I would expect something equal to the A500.

[Gryzor]

Another World *is* comprised of still screens. The cinematics aspect refers to cut scenes, things flying in front of the camera, spot sound fx, stuff like that.

[Skunkfish]

In these days of mass storage solutions, we don't have to worry about the memory limitations that Éric Chahi was trying to work around on the Amiga/ST.

This could be the first game to really flex the muscles of those storage solutions....

[Misel982001]

so from our conversation so far, I many infer that contemporary cpc masters can indeed creat a great ANOTHER WORLD game for the plain CPC as well as its sequel, THE HEART OF THE ALIEN which was released only for sega saturn.

[VincentGR]

As @eto said.
You can't compare it with flashback, fb is using sprites.
Sound fx is not a problem, we could live without them.
Maybe some noise from the AY or that thingy that @roudoudou made back then with the singing bird (if I remember correctly)


@Otto I agree with the snes cpu, nintendo was yelling back then about the pc engine not being a true 16bit... well well.

[andycadley]

Since PRINCE OF PERSIA was running well, wouldn't it be possible that a version with still screens instead of cinematics be created on a plain cpc? If we were talking about a plus version . I would expect something equal to the A500.

I'm a massive fan of the Plus hardware, but I'm not about to kid myself that it's equal to an A500. I think you could do a passable version of an Another World/Flashback style game (and have been tempted to try), but I think it would be better to tailor the game around the hardware rather than doing a conversion that would probably end up lacking somewhat.


As for the SNES CPU, yes it was underpowered, but the graphics hardware is really quite a long way ahead of what home computers had, so most of the taxing work is lifted off onto custom hardware when playing the types of games that tended to be around at the time.

[Misel982001]

Iam not claiming that the plus is equal to an A500. However I think that is a very capable piece of hardware that was not appreciated during its short commercial life. Of course it was the era of the 16bit and the 32bit machines back then. Today however, there is a renewed interest on such machines and the PLUS is thoroughly examined. New people begin learning on old 8bit hardware. Also, new plus games are released and they look amazing.

[VincentGR]

Plus machines were 5 years late.
Even the A1200 was a piece of crap back then.

[Otto]

Iam not claiming that the plus is equal to an A500. However I think that is a very capable piece of hardware that was not appreciated during its short commercial life.

On Youtube there's a Shadow of the Beast demo running on a CPC+ , which is so amazing that it can directly be compared to the Amiga version. OK, so a demo is not a final game, but stil it's a nice demo.

I'd love to see a kind of Another-World or Flashback type game on the CPC(plus). Technically something like that should be possible, I think.

[Misel982001]

Totally agree here. A 6128 plus in 1987 or 1988 would have been a radical piece of hardware, very capable and with a large dedicated user base. In 1992 the A1200 was very outdated and slow. It should have been launched with the same hardware as A4000T in order it stood a chance....and still it would have failed. The PCs had already dominated the market since IBM had allowed other manufacturers to market their own combatible hardware.

[roudoudou]

On Youtube there's a Shadow of the Beast demo running on a CPC+ , which is so amazing that it can directly be compared to the Amiga version.

there is a shadow of the beast game work in progress (but less impressive than a one screen intro FX obviously)
there is some previews on youtube => https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCX7PR_ROWYA36FTFQptStaQ