Will mast... wanking... er... doing serious researches ::) on the web, I found out a strange thing...
(http://cpcwiki.eu/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=2262.0;attach=1655;image)
Ok look closely at this mountain...
Yes, they reused it.
Well it seems slightly redone and of course use another palette, yet the design is clearly the same (Youtube pictures, not best quality nor that accuratez pixels)
So, do some of you have other examples of such thing in games ?
Very similar, the Mountain in Operation Thunderbolt seems to have a more tip at the Summit of the Hill, where the Mountain in Burnin' Rubber has a more gradual rise to towards the Summit. Though the detail on the face on the side of both hills is a weird coincidence! :)
The most obvious example I can see with Re-Used Graphics is in Roland in Time and Roland in Space.
Roland is the same in both games, though in Roland in Space there's extra definitions of Roland not shown in Roland in Time. Some of Rolands Friends such as the Bird, Helicopter & the same ol bombs are featured in both games.
Obviously though Roland doesn't always look the same as he differs in the other Roland games, though it just appears that Roland in Space and Roland in Time share the same production crew, if not simular.
But Roland in Space has cool hardware speech ;)
Quote from: Devilmarkus on 19:16, 17 May 11
But Roland in Space has cool hardware speech ;)
You mean the Firmware Hardware Scrolling thing moving the screen around? Haven't heard any Digitized sound if that's what you mean.
Well, connect an Amstrad SSA-1 speech synth.- module to your CPC and you will hear...
Or use JavaCPC -> Misc Settings -> Enable speechsynthesis -> Select Amstrad SSA-1 emulation.
Or check my video:
SSA-1 Speech synthesizer used in CPC game "Roland in space" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YcgUZG_jz20#)
Quote from: Devilmarkus on 09:05, 18 May 11
Well, connect an Amstrad SSA-1 speech synth.- module to your CPC and you will hear...
Or use JavaCPC -> Misc Settings -> Enable speechsynthesis -> Select Amstrad SSA-1 emulation.
Bizarre!
Oh and it appears some of those cloud like platforms from that Roland in Space Preview were also in Roland in Time! ;D
Quote from: Devilmarkus on 09:05, 18 May 11
Well, connect an Amstrad SSA-1 speech synth.- module to your CPC and you will hear...
Or use JavaCPC -> Misc Settings -> Enable speechsynthesis -> Select Amstrad SSA-1 emulation.
I remember that 3D Stunt Rider used the speech synthesizer to say "Prepare to jump" :laugh:
Quote from: mcklain on 12:07, 18 May 11
I remember that 3D Stunt Rider used the speech synthesizer to say "Prepare to jump" :laugh:
True.
Together with Kukulcan I made a list for all speech compatible games we found:
http://www.cpc-power.com/index.php?page=detail&num=4725 (http://www.cpc-power.com/index.php?page=detail&num=4725)
(Scroll down to "jeux compatible")
Well, the dk'tronics speech synthesizer list is a bit smaller:
http://www.cpc-power.com/index.php?page=detail&num=4724 (http://www.cpc-power.com/index.php?page=detail&num=4724)
Interesting for Roland In Space is:
Amsoft released this piece of crap in 1984!!!
The SSA-1 was released in 1985!!!
The beta testing took longer than expected :laugh:
Quote from: Devilmarkus on 12:09, 18 May 11
Interesting for Roland In Space is:
Amsoft released this piece of crap in 1984!!!
The SSA-1 was released in 1985!!!
Ok I acknowledge that Roland In Space isn't state of the art, but a piece of crap is something I'd use to describe "Count Duckula 2" or "Howard the Duck". How can Roland in Space fit in the same category? ??? That's unfair! :(
How fun this topic sliped into Synthespeech devices...
perhaps opening or re-opening a topic on those could be more usefull then.
The bad thçing with those specch synthetizers... there are not compatibles...
BTW I always wondered the possible application in Chiptune.
Can you get the stuff singing ?
Is it heavy on CPU and/or RAM to get them to be used ?
Kraftwerk seem to use those.
The speech synthesis concept is quite old in fact:
From memory I recall that when you used the SSA-1 the computer stopped completely. I always wondered what was inside that piece of plastic (besides the stereo amplifier). I know that speech synthesis could be done via software in the amstrad, as you can hear in the spanish text-adventure game "el enigma de aceps". http://www.cpc-power.com/index.php?page=detail&num=814 (http://www.cpc-power.com/index.php?page=detail&num=814)
Jump to 0:58 to hear it (the synthesis is not very good if you can understand spanish).
BTW, Kraftwerk always used a mix of vocoders, voice modulators and speech synthesizers. :)
And speaking of computers singing:
Can get more cooler than this :laugh:
I just remembered a demo for Commodore plus/4 that had a synthesized voice singing the main tune of the demo, but I can't find the video on youtube :(
The NEC PC6601 (don't remember which model) was supplied with inbuilt "vocosynth".
Got to remember that those NEC machines were actually sporting the same tecnical specs as Speccy (PC-6001) or CPC (depending on the model...NEC PC-6601 and PC-6001 MK2).
http://www.cpcwiki.eu/forum/index.php?topic=1798.0 (http://www.cpcwiki.eu/forum/index.php?topic=1798.0)
Just the more advanced versions (latter series... PC-6001 MK2 SR and PC-6601 SR) got their Video resolution "overclocked" (feature we miss cruelly on PLUS imo...)
Also bigger RAM because of the various Japanese characters... which needed better resolutions actually, hence the "overclocked" video on latter models.
And also the Palette is limited compaired to CPC.
Just imagine a CPC with ZX Speccy's palette (sort of) and in-built SSA-1.
Quote from: mcklain on 12:57, 19 May 11
From memory I recall that when you used the SSA-1 the computer stopped completely.
yes the code wrote the allophone and waited for the sound to finish, really you only need to check it 1 time a frame.. so interrupt speech is possible ;)
Quote from: arnoldemu on 13:37, 19 May 11
yes the code wrote the allophone and waited for the sound to finish, really you only need to check it 1 time a frame.. so interrupt speech is possible ;)
This sounds ... interesting. From a quick scan of the manual of the SSA-1 on the wiki, it seems to suggest you could add support for in-game speech through the SSA that doesnt cause the game to halt with only a few dozen bytes of code and data and less than a scan line per frame of CPU time. Would that be correct, could it be that simple?
Quote from: Axelay on 09:44, 20 May 11
This sounds ... interesting. From a quick scan of the manual of the SSA-1 on the wiki, it seems to suggest you could add support for in-game speech through the SSA that doesnt cause the game to halt with only a few dozen bytes of code and data and less than a scan line per frame of CPU time. Would that be correct, could it be that simple?
yes, that simple.
You write 1 allophone code to the ssa-1. then in the vsync or another int, you can poll it to see if it finished speaking. If it did, send the next.
So interrupt driven speech is easy!
If anyone plans to write a program to use speech this way, please support both ssa-1 and dk'tronics. The code to support both is very similar.
Now we just need to make them sing XD
Quote from: mcklain on 12:57, 19 May 11
I know that speech synthesis could be done via software in the amstrad, as you can hear in the spanish text-adventure game "el enigma de aceps". http://www.cpc-power.com/index.php?page=detail&num=814 (http://www.cpc-power.com/index.php?page=detail&num=814)
Jump to 0:58 to hear it (the synthesis is not very good if you can understand spanish).
I had no idea that you could do speech via software. It sounds pretty distorted, but I would like to know if it's possible to refine the sound and also, how memory intensive is this?
Quote from: arnoldemu on 09:50, 20 May 11
yes, that simple.
You write 1 allophone code to the ssa-1. then in the vsync or another int, you can poll it to see if it finished speaking. If it did, send the next.
So interrupt driven speech is easy!
If anyone plans to write a program to use speech this way, please support both ssa-1 and dk'tronics. The code to support both is very similar.
Nice. Or possibly another stupid idea, but if the over head is so low, gotta be worth a look. I did see the DK seems near identical barring the port, so I had thought that would be the thing to do, bound to be few enough people with the things as it is without restricting it to one model!
I dont have one my self, so what emulators support these speech synths? JavaCPC, any others?
Quote from: mcklain on 09:53, 20 May 11
Now we just need to make them sing XD
Well, I'd settle for the occasional "Destroy the core!" :)
Not sure any emulator support those.
Weren't one of those supposed to speack "english" and the other one to speack "french" ?
The technimusique ? (even less supported I guess)
I think there were more than only 2 models available...I may be wrong.
Anyway, this is a more interesting piece of crap than what was actually done for it at the time.
What would be needed to re-do some card that would emulate/re-do those cards ?
a modern redo which would be able to switch between both cards could be nice.
Also check if this is possible to get them talking betterly = more understandable and less robot voice...
The timing of sounds must be important, also the "melody" (accentuation, long or short sounds...) but this then must be more CPU intensive or even RAM intensive.
Java CPC supports the SSA-1.
I just remembered about the one from MHT Ingenieros, the spanish hardware company:
http://www.cpcwiki.eu/index.php/MHT_Speech_Synthesizer (http://www.cpcwiki.eu/index.php/MHT_Speech_Synthesizer)
This one speaks in spanish :)
I always wondered what they did to get those aliens to talk like that in some of those 60s Dr. Whos! ;D 60s Cybermen are particularly interesting! ;D
Quote from: CP/M User on 13:25, 20 May 11
I always wondered what they did to get those aliens to talk like that in some of those 60s Dr. Whos! ;D 60s Cybermen are particularly interesting! ;D
Quote** The BBC did the first Cyberman voices by actually building a mockup of the human vocal system, running a stream of air through it, and adjusting it to produce the sounds that made up the speech for the Cybermen. Later versions simply had an actor's voice run through a ring modulator with a different setting to what was used for the Daleks.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SyntheticVoiceActor?action=source (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SyntheticVoiceActor?action=source)
This would be great... :P
Quote from: MacDeath on 23:50, 20 May 11
This would be great... :P
I was wondering myself if something similar was possible. :D
Have you heard the song to Portal 2?
Portal 2: End Credits Song 'Want You Gone' by Jonathan Coulton [1080p HD] (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dVVZaZ8yO6o#ws)
Quote from: MaV on 00:11, 21 May 11
Have you heard the song to Portal 2?
I'm waiting for the price to drop below 15€ to buy it :laugh:
would a portal game possible in 2D ? ::)
Quote from: mcklain on 14:07, 20 May 11
Quote** The BBC did the first Cyberman voices by actually building a mockup of the human vocal system, running a stream of air through it, and adjusting it to produce the sounds that made up the speech for the Cybermen. Later versions simply had an actor's voice run through a ring modulator with a different setting to what was used for the Daleks.
The first Cybermen story was The Tenth Planet which was the Last story for William Hartnell as Doctor and yes the Cybermen do sound and appear quite different to the ones which followed. The second Story which was The Moonbase, I've only seen the remains of that story once and don't quite remember how they looked or appeared. The other two of the three I know quite well is The Tomb of the Cybermen and The Invasion. In Tomb they sort of Appear like the ones from The Tenth Planet, though appear more metallic, the speech from them sounds so mechanical and Robotic in nature, some of it was a bit hard to interpret! :D Cybermen don't talk much in the Invasion, but when they do they sound different again, having like a lower tone which seems cuddly and cute! :D Cybermen were also in The Wheel in Space, though it's one story I haven't got an audio from, there is one episode which wasn't deleted or burned by the BBC which I would have on my Lost in Time DVD.
So it seems those BBC Boys at Radio Workshop had a few ways of playing around with voice techniques! :D
Quote from: MacDeath on 03:28, 21 May 11
would a portal game possible in 2D ? ::)
Well, there's Portal ASCII for one.
But I was rather referring to the song + (text-)graphics for a demo on a CPC which will be hard enough.
Anyway sorry aghain for out-topic-ing (again, as ever)
but portal "still alive" tune is freaking catchy as hell...
When you know even just a little about the game (but still a nerdz of course), it is quite fun and the woman who sing just sings... too perfectly.
I'm even sure sure tune could have made it into the charts if given to one of the famous hot bitc.... singer of the moment.
Let's say a girl like P!nk would do it quite well IMO (with a rockier voice of course...).
I'm inpressed, this reminded me the quality of WOW's "Lament of the Highborn" (Sindorei song)
To be fair, when I heard this for the first time... I almost jeezed in my pants (also because my Blood Elf palladiness gained a lvl thx to the quest which starts the song ::) ).
Quite like when I heard the H.A.T.E chiptune for the first time (as a child...)
Or the Synthevocals on Robocop....
except that I was perhaps a bit too young to jizz...mmmh, forget about the last 2 lines after all...
The nowaday's Chiptune equivalent (= video games music) is more like a score, and can get its share of hits...
Just like Conan movie's music (Poledouris...) or anything else...
Quote from: CP/M User on 09:25, 21 May 11So it seems those BBC Boys at Radio Workshop had a few ways of playing around with voice techniques! :D
The documentaries that I've seen about the BBC Radio Workshop are really amazing ;D
Quote from: MacDeath on 03:28, 21 May 11
would a portal game possible in 2D ? ::)
http://portal.wecreatestuff.com/ (http://portal.wecreatestuff.com/)
Quote from: MacDeath on 11:49, 21 May 11
I'm inpressed, this reminded me the quality of WOW's "Lament of the Highborn" (Sindorei song)
WoW is for little kiddies. You should try EVE (http://www.eveonline.com/), it's uber. It also has much better songs about it:
Quote from: MacDeath on 11:49, 21 May 11
Quite like when I heard the H.A.T.E chiptune for the first time (as a child...)
Got a link for this?
Quote from: redbox on 20:38, 21 May 11Got a link for this?
I'm trying to figure out how to do that "resonant filter" synth sound from the begining of the song in arkos. I guess that it's a question of playing with the hardware envelopes. :-X
This reminds me H.A.T.E was also one of the speccy ports of death.
Ok, many detail give it a free go as a good game, yet...
I think sprites (masked) could have got some different colours than the background...
Also a bit sluggish, but this is not the biggest offence, biggest offence being the monocolour playfield...
Yet the Awesome music got it pass through the speccyport bashings.
Quote from: MacDeath on 01:42, 22 May 11
Yet the Awesome music got it pass through the speccyport bashings.
I wonder if they should of put the sound effects on the channel with the drum beat. That would of made the omission of that particular channel less noticeable, as putting the sound effect on the channel with the bass riff hurts it a little.