Author Topic: Throne Legacy  (Read 1701 times)

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Offline Arnaud

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Throne Legacy
« on: 12:07, 07 November 20 »
Hi to all,
the official videos of the CPCRetroDev 2020 are online and here a longer video of gameplay with the intro :


https://youtu.be/ceXRfyZikNw

As you see it looks a lot like l'Aigle d'or, i tried to improve technically and visually the game and make another and a totally different adventure.
Of course it can't be better than the original but i hope it will be at least fun to play and reminds good memories.

Once again thanks to CPCPower and Titan for intro (and story), Ced for make and greatly improve graphics and SLT for tireless testing (more than 100 bugs found i can't believe it).

Now let's wait for the jury's results :)
« Last Edit: 15:59, 08 November 20 by Arnaud »

Offline Targhan

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #1 on: 12:41, 07 November 20 »
I will be strong and not click on this preview, or any other preview from the Retrodev as I don't want to be spoiled the surprise. I'll be STRONG!!! :)
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Offline ervin

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #2 on: 12:56, 07 November 20 »
@Arnaud - Year after year I've watched your games get better and better.
This is absolutely stunning! Congratulations!
It's one of the submitted games I'm most looking forward to playing.

I'm wondering, is that a mode 0/mode 2 rupture?
Can that be done from cpctelera?
My (cancelled) entry for the CPCRetroDev 2017 Competition http://www.cpcwiki.eu/forum/programming/my-cpcretrodev-2017-entry/
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Offline Arnaud

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #3 on: 13:10, 07 November 20 »
I'm wondering, is that a mode 0/mode 2 rupture?
Can that be done from cpctelera?
Yes it's really easy, you have an example in cpctelera in advanced/interrupts and in the source of my game in some days.

By the way, your multi scrolling engine is really fast and smooth, i can't wait playing with your game.

Offline ervin

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #4 on: 13:16, 07 November 20 »
Yes it's really easy, you have an example in cpctelera in advanced/interrupts and in the source of my game in some days.

By the way, your multi scrolling engine is really fast and smooth, i can't wait playing with your game.

Thanks, but my game is actually really terrible!
It is incomplete, and almost all interesting features had to be dropped due to time and RAM limitations.
My game also slows down quite a lot in areas where lots of things need to be checked for display/collisions.
I need to find a better way of checking for such things.

Towards the end I hated working on my game, and considered quitting many times.
I decided to submit it anyway, because the character was created by my daughter, and I didn't want to disappoint her.

After watching all the previews, it looks like there are many more games that will be more fun to play than Goatfish.
Oh well.

Anyway, sorry to hijack this thread.
This thread should be about your wonderful game.
 :)
« Last Edit: 13:19, 07 November 20 by ervin »
My (cancelled) entry for the CPCRetroDev 2017 Competition http://www.cpcwiki.eu/forum/programming/my-cpcretrodev-2017-entry/
FAST line drawing in CPCtelera http://www.cpcwiki.eu/forum/programming/drawing-lines-with-cpctelera-sdcc/
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Offline awergh

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #5 on: 13:26, 07 November 20 »
Of the trailers this is the game that most impressed me.
You clearly succeeded but how did you go with fitting everything into memory?

Thanks, but my game is actually really terrible!
It is incomplete, and almost all interesting features had to be dropped due to time and RAM limitations.
My game also slows down quite a lot in areas where lots of things need to be checked for display/collisions.
I need to find a better way of checking for such things.

Towards the end I hated working on my game, and considered quitting many times.
I decided to submit it anyway, because the character was created by my daughter, and I didn't want to disappoint her.

After watching all the previews, it looks like there are many more games that will be more fun to play than Goatfish.
Oh well.

Anyway, sorry to hijack this thread.
This thread should be about your wonderful game.
 :)

It is hard not to get a little bit sick of your codebase, especially after obsessing over it for a while.
I'm sure it will be well worth the play even if it doesn't quite meet your artistic vision.

Offline ervin

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #6 on: 13:31, 07 November 20 »
Of the trailers this is the game that most impressed me.
You clearly succeeded but how did you go with fitting everything into memory?

It is hard not to get a little bit sick of your codebase, especially after obsessing over it for a while.
I'm sure it will be well worth the play even if it doesn't quite meet your artistic vision.

That's the thing... I didn't fit everything into memory.
I literally removed entire features (which were already working and tested).
There just wasn't enough RAM left to store the data needed to utilise those features.
I shouldn't have used a double-buffered screen.
There isn't really much of a game in there. The level design was rushed and thrown together at the last minute.
Ah well, maybe next year I'll do better.
 8)
My (cancelled) entry for the CPCRetroDev 2017 Competition http://www.cpcwiki.eu/forum/programming/my-cpcretrodev-2017-entry/
FAST line drawing in CPCtelera http://www.cpcwiki.eu/forum/programming/drawing-lines-with-cpctelera-sdcc/
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Offline awergh

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #7 on: 13:37, 07 November 20 »
That's the thing... I didn't fit everything into memory.
I literally removed entire features (which were already working and tested).
There just wasn't enough RAM left to store the data needed to utilise those features.
I shouldn't have used a double-buffered screen.
There isn't really much of a game in there. The level design was rushed and thrown together at the last minute.
Ah well, maybe next year I'll do better.
 8)


Hehe whoops I was meaning Throne Legacy for the first part about memory. That said it is always hard throwing away code that works.
You are not alone in rushing your level design, I hope my levels are not impossible.
If you can try to do better each time thats the main thing. (I'm not sure trying different genres makes this easier or harder. :) )
« Last Edit: 13:40, 07 November 20 by awergh »

Offline ervin

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #8 on: 15:00, 07 November 20 »
Hehe whoops I was meaning Throne Legacy for the first part about memory. That said it is always hard throwing away code that works.
You are not alone in rushing your level design, I hope my levels are not impossible.
If you can try to do better each time thats the main thing. (I'm not sure trying different genres makes this easier or harder. :) )


Oops, my apologies!
Yes I agree. Of all the trailers, Arnaud's game impressed me the most as well.
I can't wait to play it!
My (cancelled) entry for the CPCRetroDev 2017 Competition http://www.cpcwiki.eu/forum/programming/my-cpcretrodev-2017-entry/
FAST line drawing in CPCtelera http://www.cpcwiki.eu/forum/programming/drawing-lines-with-cpctelera-sdcc/
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Offline Norman

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #9 on: 14:43, 08 November 20 »
Looks very nice, good work Arnaud!

@ervin
Off-Topic:
I wonder how you'd go about working without double buffering but still scroll the game? I reckon it'd flicker a lot because you can't draw it in one VSync. In my game I'm not doing any buffering, just waiting for the vsync, then drawing a handful of sprites but it already flickers when the sprites are close to the top (the beam is faster than my code  :) ). You just don't have many cycles, in layman terms 4MHz / 50 Hz = 80.000 cycles per vsync (minus cycles used for interrupts). Or am I totally off?

Cheers

Offline ervin

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #10 on: 14:48, 08 November 20 »
@Norman
It's an adaptive tile engine, where only "dirty" tiles are drawn each frame.
The only downside is that there would be screen-tearing (which is the reason I chose to use double-buffering).
My (cancelled) entry for the CPCRetroDev 2017 Competition http://www.cpcwiki.eu/forum/programming/my-cpcretrodev-2017-entry/
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Offline Norman

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #11 on: 15:23, 08 November 20 »
@ervin Ah, interesting. I don't completely understand how you did this, or know it only under a different name (?). If you scroll, aren't all tiles "dirty"? Is there an implementation of this to have a look at? Otherwise I hope you included your code so I can take a look on November 13th  ;)

Cheers

Offline ervin

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #12 on: 16:00, 08 November 20 »
@ervin Ah, interesting. I don't completely understand how you did this, or know it only under a different name (?). If you scroll, aren't all tiles "dirty"? Is there an implementation of this to have a look at? Otherwise I hope you included your code so I can take a look on November 13th  ;)
Cheers

@Norman I have a "front buffer" and a "back buffer" in my program.
Each buffer is (rows*columns) bytes in size. i.e. there are 32 rows and 40 columns that tiles can be printed in (40 columns, because the columns on the sides are narrower, in order to simulate a rotational scroll).
When each frame is drawn, I loop (rows*columns) times, comparing frontBuffer(i) with backBuffer(i).
If a difference is found, that tile is printed, otherwise the cell doesn't need to be printed and is skipped.
On the next frame I swap the buffer pointers, so the frontBuffer is effectively what the backBuffer was in the previous frame, and vice versa.
And then the buffers are compared again when drawing the frame.
And so on.
[EDIT] I did include the code, but it's very messy.
My (cancelled) entry for the CPCRetroDev 2017 Competition http://www.cpcwiki.eu/forum/programming/my-cpcretrodev-2017-entry/
FAST line drawing in CPCtelera http://www.cpcwiki.eu/forum/programming/drawing-lines-with-cpctelera-sdcc/
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Offline awergh

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #13 on: 14:01, 09 November 20 »
That is a helpful explanation, I will endeavour to look at the code, whether I can follow what is happening remains to be seen.
Reading other peoples code is always harder then your own especially optimised code.

Maybe next year you can make Goatfish II : The Revenge :)

Offline Norman

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #14 on: 18:36, 09 November 20 »
@ervin Thanks for the explanation, I've understood it now (probably). Will definitely look at the code. As I could see from your previous games/projects, it seems you did something similar a few years ago (adaptive tile updates). What intrigued me was using assembly for tight loops, I'll have to look into combining that with C code.

@awergh Great idea, lets see if the jury likes sequels (like Miss Input II).

Cheers

Offline Gryzor

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #15 on: 14:39, 10 November 20 »
So lovely. You should do a Dragon's Lair title to do it some justice finally :)

Offline Arnaud

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #16 on: 20:06, 18 November 20 »
Hi,
now the contest is finished (6th !) i am working on some improvements :
  • Speed up player movement
  • Make a game translation (here file to modify if someone want to translate the game, thank !)
  • Take torch from wall
  • Other ideas ?

_LONG LIVE THE KING_DEAD_NIGHT IS FALLING_IT'S DARK HERE_GROUND FLOOR_BASEMENT_FIRST FLOOR_LAST FLOOR_OUTDOORS_IT'S CLOSED_IT'S OPENED_WRONG KEY_THE LOCK RESISTS_CROWBAR BREAKS_INVENTORY IS FULL_PERSIA_LAKE OF SPIRITS_KING'S CELL_CUP OF SOULS_YOU MUST BE CROUCHING_THE CUP IS FILLED_THE DEMON IS GONE_TORCH EXTINGUISHES_TORCHES ON THE WALL CAN BE REPLACED_DEMONS FLEE WATER OF THE SOULS_THERE'S SOMETHING IN THE DARK_TORCH_LIGHTER_ROPE_CROWBAR_POTION_PRESS SUICIDE KEY AGAIN TO CONFIRM
* text.txt
(0.5 kB - downloaded 1263 times)
« Last Edit: 20:21, 18 November 20 by Arnaud »

Offline Gryzor

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #17 on: 21:16, 18 November 20 »
This came 6th? Wow that must have been a very hard competition, but congratulations and thanks so much for your awesome contribution!

Offline Targhan

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #18 on: 23:30, 18 November 20 »
This should have ranked much higher :).

For now, the only things I found "strange":
- I'd like to put back a torch on the wall (probably not mandatory)
- Maybe a little direction at the beginning, because it is not obvious the store is on the right, the castle on the left. Someone missing the store may feel frustrated, and may not have the idea to exit the castle to wander around.

I'll tell you more when I played more this week-end :).
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Offline Mr. DVG

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #19 on: 01:16, 19 November 20 »
Hi,
now the contest is finished (6th !) i am working on some improvements :
  • Speed up player movement
  • Make a game translation (here file to modify if someone want to translate the game, thank !)
  • Take torch from wall
  • Other ideas ?


Hi Arnaud, your title is one of the best in the retrodev, the gameplay is definitely captivating and I am very happy that the game will have improvements!

I propose my translation in Italian if it can be useful! :)

_LUNGA VITA AL RE _MORTO _LA NOTTE STA SCENDENDO _È BUIO QUI _PIANO TERRA _SEMINTERRATO _PRIMO PIANO _ULTIMO PIANO _ESTERNO _È CHIUSO _È APERTO _CHIAVE SBAGLIATA _LA SERRATURA RESISTE _PIEDE DI PORCO ROTTO _L'INVENTARIO È PIENO _PERSIA _LAGO DEGLI SPIRITI _CELLA DEL RE _COPPA DELLE ANIME _DEVI ESSERE ACCUCCIATO _LA COPPA È PIENA _IL DEMONE È ANDATO _LA TORCIA SI SPEGNE _LE TORCE SUL MURO POSSONO ESSERE SOSTITUITE _I DEMONI FUGGONO DALL'ACQUA DELLE ANIME _C'È QUALCOSA NEL BUIO _TORCIA _ACCENDINO _CORDA _PIEDE DI PORCO _POZIONE _PREMI DI NUOVO IL TASTO SUICIDIO PER CONFERMARE

Offline MiguelSky

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #20 on: 10:23, 19 November 20 »
And in Spanish also:


_LARGA VIDA AL REY_MUERTO_CAE LA NOCHE_ESTA OSCURO_PLANTA BAJA_SOTANO_PRIMERA PLANTA_ULTIMA PLANTA_AFUERA_ESTA CERRADA_ESTA ABIERTA_LLAVE INCORRECTA_LA CERRADURA SE RESISTE_LA PALANCA SE ROMPE_INVENTARIO LLENO_PERSIA_LAGO DE LOS ESPIRITUS_CELDA DEL REY_CALIZ DE ALMAS_DEBES ESTAR AGACHADO_EL CALIZ ESTA LLENO_EL DEMONIO SE HA IDO_ANTORCHA APAGADA_LAS ANTORCHAS DE LA PARED PUEDEN CAMBIARSE_LOS DEMONIOS HUYEN DEL AGUA DE ALMAS_HAY ALGO ENTRE LAS SOMBRAS_ANTORCHA_ENCENDEDOR_CUERDA_PALANCA_POCION_PULSA TECLA SUICIDIO OTRA VEZ PARA CONFIRMAR

Offline Arnaud

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #21 on: 19:45, 19 November 20 »
@MiguelSky, @Mr. DVG, thank for translation  :)

Offline Targhan

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #22 on: 03:30, 21 November 20 »
Ok... I've played quite a lot this evening... I've not finished the game yet but I'm sure I'm pretty close!!! I've found 2 objects and I think I explored all the rooms, but got finally killed by the "darkness".

It's a damn good game, and I invite anyone who likes a bit of adventure game to test it!

Here are some suggestions about how to improve the game:
- Why does the character lose energy when it is dark? I understand the need to "punish" the player somehow, but it's really bothersome. Maybe only remove energy for each step, but not when simply entering/leaving a room?
- When pressing esc, it's dangerous to press esc again to commit suicide. Press Y to confirm suicide, or any other key to go back to the game.
- I suggest making the player appear directly outside the castle, and remove one room to the right, so that the store is one room closer. As there are several go/back to this room, the closer, the better.
- What about a savegame? Even if "only" a memory slot. It would be really pleasant.

Well done Arnaud again! This game should have been in the top 3... And I'm going to finish it :).
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Offline Arnaud

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #23 on: 10:47, 21 November 20 »
Ok... I've played quite a lot this evening... I've not finished the game yet but I'm sure I'm pretty close!!! I've found 2 objects and I think I explored all the rooms, but got finally killed by the "darkness".
It's a damn good game, and I invite anyone who likes a bit of adventure game to test it!
Thanks !

- Why does the character lose energy when it is dark? I understand the need to "punish" the player somehow, but it's really bothersome. Maybe only remove energy for each step, but not when simply entering/leaving a room?
This is a bug, the game run too fast when nothing to draw and the life decrease too quickly, i understand better some remarks. Now the life decreases according to the number of step made.

- When pressing esc, it's dangerous to press esc again to commit suicide. Press Y to confirm suicide, or any other key to go back to the game.
I'll see if i can easily (without using more memory) use another key for confirm.

- I suggest making the player appear directly outside the castle, and remove one room to the right, so that the store is one room closer. As there are several go/back to this room, the closer, the better.
Agree, i move the room to the direction for the lac.

- What about a savegame? Even if "only" a memory slot. It would be really pleasant.
Why not, but i need code to save Amsdos file without firmware and i think i have only 20 or 30 bytes free :)

Well done Arnaud again! This game should have been in the top 3... And I'm going to finish it :).
Good luck.

Offline Targhan

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Re: Throne Legacy
« Reply #24 on: 11:18, 21 November 20 »
Oh, two other suggestions:
- I think it may be a bug, but the room just before the "cup of souls" room is "outside". Is it normal?? It feels strange to be in a castle, and then outside, and then in the castle again. Plus this room "feels" like in the castle because of the "invisible walls" when moving in the background.
- The two keys "fire/selection" are actually bothersome and it could be improved. I'm sure you can only use one. Here's how: Press fire and you would go to the latest of the two "hand  object" you used. Fire again would use it. Down will put the hand object in the inventory. And left/right will make the cursor go from the hands object but also to the inventory without limitation. Simpler, no?

Quote
Why not, but i need code to save Amsdos file without firmware and i think i have only 20 or 30 bytes free
Or a in-memory savegame. For example, each time you use a staircase, a savegame would be done in memory, and if you die, you can reload it.
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