RetroGamer 100 Greatest Retro Games (18 of which were released for the CPC)

[cwpab]

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1EfZaYnO0kJVm--VgYRegGm7f2WEGN1NF/view

100 - Civilization
99 - Pitfall!
98 - Bombjack
97 - The Sentinel
96 - Prince of Persia
95 - StarCraft
94 - Shining Force III
93 - Day of the Tentacle
92 - Ultima IV: Quest of the Avatar
91 - Robotron: 2084
90 - Mario Kart 64
89 - Bomberman
88 - Diablo
87 - Street Fighter III: 3rd Strike
86 - The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask
85 - Dropzone
84 - EarthBound
83 - Doom II
82 - Chrono Trigger
81 - Marble Madness
80 - Virtua Fighter
79 - Rainbow Islands
78 - Double Dragon
77 - Wolfenstein 3D
76 - Diablo II
75 - Phantasy Star Online
74 - Spacewar!
73 - Metroid Prime
72 - Tony Hawk's Pro Skater 2
71 - SimCity
70 - Super Monkey Ball
69 - The Elder Scrolls III: Morrowind
68 - Soul Calibur
67 - Shadow of the Colossus
66 - Jet Set Radio
65 - The Legend of Zelda
64 - Sega Rally Championship
63 - Command & Conquer Red Alert
62 - Ico
61 - Ultima VII: The Black Gate
60 - Resident Evil 2
59 - Daytona USA
58 - Crazy Taxi
57 - Rez
56 - Paradroid
55 - Galaga
54 - Gran Turismo
53 - Baldur's Gate
52 - Quake
51 - Sonic Adventure
50 - Wipeout
49 - Outrun 2
48 - Silent Hill 2
47 - Grand Theft Auto: Vice City
46 - Super Mario Bros 3
45 - Pokémon Red/Blue
44 - Sensible World of Soccer
43 - Sonic The Hedgehog 2
42 - Castlevania: Symphony of the Night
41 - Manic Miner
40 - Space Harrier
39 - Final Fantasy VIII
38 - Deus Ex
37 - Streets of Rage 2
36 - World of Warcraft
35 - Asteroids
34 - Final Fantasy VII
33 - Lemmings
32 - Gauntlet
31 - Defender
30 - Half Life 2
29 - Super Metroid
28 - Pong
27 - Resident Evil
26 - Resident Evil 4
25 - The Secret of Monkey Island
24 - Grand Theft Auto III
23 - Halo: Combat Evolved
22 - R-Type
21 - Donkey Kong
20 - Tomb Raider
19 - Shenmue II
18 - Outrun
17 - Metal Gear Solid
16 - Super Mario Kart
15 - Half-Life
14 - 007 GoldenEye
13 - Sonic the Hedgehog
12 - Space Invaders
11 - The Legend of Zelda: A Link to the Past
10 - Super Mario World
  9 - Shenmue
  8 - Super Mario Bros
  7 - Elite
  6 - Pac-Man
  5 - The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time
  4 - Street Fighter II: The World Warrior
  3 - Super Mario 64
  2 - Doom
  1 - Tetris

The list is confusing for a number of reasons:
1) They asked developers, journalists and users about the games which were more relevant to the industry, but called the list "the greatest games". Not exactly the same.
2) If they are the most relevant to the industry, then around 20 games should not be there because they are sequels very similar to the previous game: Doom II, Shenmue II, many Zeldas...
3) Super Monkey Ball is on the list, but not games like Bubble Bobble.
4) There are 17 RPG, but only 2 sports games.
5) The only European football game on the list is Sensible Soccer... Sorry, but no. Matchday 2 was better 5 years earlier, and Konami games destroy it.

All in all, a fun topic to debate.

[cwpab]

Also, the data I'm going to mention just feels wrong. The list contains:

- 5 Marios (including Donkey Kong, where you also control Mario)
- 4 Zeldas
- 3 Sonics
- 3 Resident Evils
- 1 Tomb Raider
- 1 Super Monkey Ball
- 1 Prince of Persia
- 1 Monkey Island
- 1 Maniac Mansion
- 0 Indiana Jones graphic adventures
- 0 Space Quests
- 0 King's Quests
- 0 Gabriel Knights
- 0 Oddword "Abe's" games
- 0 Spyros
- 0 Another World/Flashbacks
- 0 Crash Bandicoots
- 0 Klonoas
- 0 Saboteurs
- 0 Bruce Lee (the only one)

Basically, the people who voted barely play graphic adventure games and believe platform games are Mario and Sonic, conceding a Tomb Raider and unexpectedly a Prince of Persia, which barely made the cut (it's #96). The fact that Super Monkey Ball is there and Abe's Oddysee, Spyro or Another World are not is baffling, and the only possible explanation is that the game was released exclusively for a console of a certain Japanese manufacturer with very intense followers. 

[cwpab]

The list feels more normal when it comes to FPS games, but the This Is One Of The 10 Games for My Nintendo Console And Therefore Is A Masterpiece syndrome returns with 007 Goldeneye on #14 while Quake is only #52. 

Both Quake and Goldeneye are great games in their own styles, but Quake was released 1 year earlier and was definitely more influential (for example, Half-Life used an improved version of Quake's engine!). 

[robcfg]

Any list without System Shock on it, is automatically rubbish 

[cwpab]

Any list without System Shock on it, is automatically rubbish 

I can't play that one because games with RPG elements give me anxiety, but it looks greaet and it was innovative at the time, so... It's just another example (along with Bruce Lee, Bubble Bobble, Another World, Abe's Oddysee and others) of a game that could and should be there instead of the multiple sequels that were too similar to the previous games (I count 15, maybe I'm being too cruel with Mario Kart 64 as it was 3D instead of mode-7):

Mario Kart 64
Street Fighter III: 3rd Strike
The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask
Doom II
Diablo II
Resident Evil 2
Outrun 2
Grand Theft Auto: Vice City
Super Mario Bros 3
Sonic The Hedgehog 2
Final Fantasy VIII
Half Life 2
Resident Evil 4
Shenmue II
Super Mario World

By the way, what's the deal with Street Fighter III? I'm not a fan of the genre, but I remember my fighting fans friends were mostly talking about Xmen Vs Street Fighter, Street Fighter Alpha 3, Darkstalkers and others instead of this one. Am I missing something? EDIT: The list itself explains it on the PDF: it's because of a 2004 meme from an eSports competition... Sigh. Not that eSports with retro games are not cool, but not exactly a reason to add this game to this list?

[cwpab]

BTW @Gryzor Could you please correct the following errors on the list? 

1) "86 - The Legend of Zelda" should be "86 - The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask"
2) "78 - Double Dragom" should be "78 - Double Dragon"

[Gryzor]

Dude, where's Animal Vegetable Mineral? It led to the whole AI thingie you know... /s

[cwpab]

I have more objections! 

- It appears developers input was more valued that players input, and for this reason Spacewar! and Pac-Man are present instead of, you know, some more Final Fantasys, Halos and stuff. Or the Zelda which looks like cartoons. However, Spacewar! is 74 and Pac-Man is among the top 10. I disagree with this: Spacewar! was much more influential. In 1992, Star Control II basically uses a very similar combat system... 30 years later! In comparison, Pac-Man clones felt old by 1985. The very next year Pac-Man was released (1981), Donkey Kong left it obsolete. And even in the same year (1980), Berzerk is a superior game. Don't get me wrong, Pac-Man introduced mascots and powerups and helped girls get into games, but... it's boring after 1 minute and gameplay style was not that influential.

- It's really weird that no text adventures whatsoever appear on the list. Especially when graphic adventures wouldn't exist without them. I wish I could say RPG were also inspired by it, but apparently they exist since 1974 and Colossal Cave is from 1976. 

[Gryzor]

Eh, Spacewar was influential not as a game, but as a technology and as a product.

Oh, hands down one of the most gorgeous cabs ever, too. 

[andycadley]

Honestly, if you look at the modern gaming industry, text adventures really didn't have that much impact. They were the most narrative driven stuff at the time, but the modern narrative driven it games is clearly a lot more influenced by Hollywood than text adventures.

Goldeneye definitely deserves it's spot, it was pretty much the game that legitimised console FPS games and that's the bulk of the market these days.

Some of the others like Majora's Mask and RE2, I probably wouldn't include. Although both the Zelda and RE franchises have certainly steered the industry multiple times, justifying multiple entries in the list.

Others like Doom/Doom II or various Street Fighters is really the result of splitting the votes somewhat, which is inevitable if you don't curate them somewhat.

[MaV]

I'm missing "Theaterwide Biotoxic and Chemical Warfare" and "Global Thermonuclear War" on that list. Two online games with text-to-speech support in frickin' 1983.

So underrated and so frequently overlooked by media up to this day.