upgrading 464 costs.

[TotO]

Using a 464 V3 mainboard, it is possible to add an internal expansion port and plug a X-MEM inside.
So, the DDI-1 can be plugged alone on the external expansion port and keep the desktop clean.

[TFM]

What if I don't need other expansions? he mother just for additional expansions?

But you will need:
- PlayCity (enhanced GFX, SFX and more more more)
- Mass Storage Device
- Mini-Booster to finally get stuff from the PC in a decent way


Uups... You need an X5 ;-)

[opqa]

For about 60€ you could get:
An X-MEM MX4 Board
A MotherX4 512KB ROM board (no RAM expansion)
A Mini-Booster
For 10€ more you could have an X-MEM with 512KB ROM/512KB RAM
And for about 5€ more you could get the mini-booster with a blutooth module.

Now, the interesting part, what I think you could do with that...

1) You should ask specifically to ship your X-MEM board with SNArkos ROM from the Arkos ROM Pack flashed in, as am I'm not sure whether there is a way to flash ROMS to the X-MEM through the Mini-Booster, if that were the case this first pre-requisite wouldn't be needed.
Besides this, you could also ask for other ROMS of your interest. There is also a list of games ported to ROM in the CPCWiki, you could take a look there, but I don't know if the guys from centpoucent would be willing to do you the favour of burning a long list of ROMS for you prior to shipping.

2) Once with this, you could use the SNArkos ROM to transfer snapshots from a PC to the CPC, either via bluetooth (if you bought the bluetooth module), or via USB cable. This way you might be able to play to many games that only make use of 64KB, and *maybe* some of them that use 128KB ONLY IF you bought the 512KB ROM/512KB RAM X-MEM.

Cons./Limitations of this method

1) You should use the PC/laptop as a loader each time you'd want to load a game this way (via snapshot, for the ROM ported games it'd be much faster of course)
2) Games that make use of the 3.5" drive to load levels will not work. Also if the game has the option to save the game state to the 3.5" it won't work.
3) All this is theory, you might encounter *unsolvable* incompatibilities.

[Joseman]

If i have understood right, there are many "massive storage" solutions planned for 2015, perhaps is a good idea to buy the x-mem, and wait for this solutions to come?

[CraigsBar]

If i have understood right, there are many "massive storage" solutions planned for 2015, perhaps is a good idea to buy the x-mem, and wait for this solutions to come?

Getting an x-mem is always good. And the 512k rom gives you the ability for instant loading whilst waiting for the mass storage devices to come.


With the direct SD Card access on the HxC through Symbos the mass storage is coming.


Craig

[Joseman]

With the direct SD Card access on the HxC through Symbos the mass storage is coming.

this is not the problem, who has a Symbiface (like me) has a mass storage solution, the problem is the ROM perfectly merged with AMSDOS for high compatibility, plus the modification of games that disconnect or overwrite the roms memory (#a600 and so on).

The solution is a good ROM and fat32 implementation for this mass storage solutions, and, i think that is in development with this new massive storage solutions...

[opqa]

No massive storage solution is going to be compatible with 100% of disc games.

1) Games that make use of the 3.5" floppy drive to load data after initial loading are not going to be compatible with any massive storage solution
2) Games that load/save states to disc also won't, unless they use the firmware to do that, which I believe it's not the usual case.
3) Any disk-protected game isn't going to load from a massive storage solution, you should look for the unprotected/cracked version if available.

The alternative I propose doesn't solve 1) and 2), but at least can deal with 3), you can always load the protected game in an emulator and take a snapshot in the main screen.

4) Oh, and I forgot, no massive storage solution is going able to load tape games unless they have been previously converted to disk. But you can always take a snapshot in an emulator.

[Joseman]

No massive storage solution is going to be compatible with 100% of disc games.

in fact, only with luck, the 1% of disc games, will work...

The vast majority reset the rom block and enable only amsdos, or overwrite the firmware block, or overwrite the space of the expansion rom (the rom that will path amsdos), everyone has to know and be clear about, it's needed to rework ALL the games and his loaders to work with ANY massive storage solution.

In the last months i learned a lot of tape loaders to transfer games to disk, and i will learn more, i've made several games to work with massive storage expansions (present and future). And other people will do the same with the games that they like to work with this storages... Is the only solution for this games and this massive storage solutions.

For me snapshots are not valid, i want the games with his loading screens and the code intact, with snapshots you don't have this and throw away all the multiload games (unforgivable), no, this is the wrong solution. I you want the best for your CPC, it will cost time for you, I spent months fighting with loaders and copy protections, but the games that i like will work with this massive storage solutions, I promise!

it's my opinion...

[opqa]

Maybe, but we are talking about Carnivac's case, with its constraints. I just propose the option, he'll decide if it suits his needs.

[Bryce]

4) Oh, and I forgot, no massive storage solution is going able to load tape games unless they have been previously converted to disk. But you can always take a snapshot in an emulator.

The DivIDE 2K11 for the Spectrum can load TAP files from a CF card, so tape loading should be possible. Not sure how it is done though.

Bryce.

[mr_lou]

The DivIDE 2K11 for the Spectrum can load TAP files from a CF card, so tape loading should be possible. Not sure how it is done though.

I think it just loads the binary data into memory somehow.
Having tried the 2k11, all Z80 images instantly starts up, but the TAP images doesn't. After selecting a TAP file, you have to manually type LOAD"" in the standard startup screen before it starts.

[Bryce]

Yes, but that still means that there is some on-the-fly conversion being done directly on the 2K11 doesn't it? This could be done for the CPC too.

Bryce.

[mr_lou]

Yes, but that still means that there is some on-the-fly conversion being done directly on the 2K11 doesn't it?

I wouldn't know. With my limited knowledge, I could guess that the LOAD"" command on the ZX Spectrum calls a routine that loads from tape - but stops when a certain bit somewhere is set. So the 2k11 could theoretically just put all the data as loaded, and with the bit set. This would result in the game starting up instantly after calling LOAD""

This could be done for the CPC too.

I love such statements. Gimme more like those. 

[Carnivius]

Aw heck, I go perform a show for the night and come back and this has all gone super techy confusing for me. 

I will grab the bits that stood out for me for the moment while trying to make sense of things. 

If i have understood right, there are many "massive storage" solutions planned for 2015, perhaps is a good idea to buy the x-mem, and wait for this solutions to come?

Ok so I've managed to decide so far is that I need an X-Mem first and leave the storage til later.  But even choosing what optional features on it is a puzzle it seems.

For about 60€ you could get:
An X-MEM MX4 Board
A MotherX4 512KB ROM board (no RAM expansion)
A Mini-Booster
For 10€ more you could have an X-MEM with 512KB ROM/512KB RAM
And for about 5€ more you could get the mini-booster with a blutooth module.

That sounds doable.   

1) You should ask specifically to ship your X-MEM board with SNArkos ROM from the Arkos ROM Pack flashed in, as am I'm not sure whether there is a way to flash ROMS to the X-MEM through the Mini-Booster, if that were the case this first pre-requisite wouldn't be needed.
Besides this, you could also ask for other ROMS of your interest. There is also a list of games ported to ROM in the CPCWiki, you could take a look there, but I don't know if the guys from centpoucent would be willing to do you the favour of burning a long list of ROMS for you prior to shipping.

And this is where it gets confusing again.  I don't what what Arkos or Snarkos is.  All I understanding about this ROM thing is that you can transfer games to it to load up instantly like a cartridge (or like how BASIC is there immediately when you switch on the CPC?).  How do you choose which game to load from the ROM?

Using a 464 V3 mainboard, it is possible to add an internal expansion port and plug a X-MEM inside.
So, the DDI-1 can be plugged alone on the external expansion port and keep the desktop clean.

How do I know which 464 I have?      And is this something that requires techy skills like soldering and stuff?

[Joseman]

How do I know which 464 I have?      And is this something that requires techy skills like soldering and stuff?

No but you have to open the 464, the version is printed on the pcb.

cpc models on cpcwiki:

Mainboard Versions - CPCWiki

[Carnivius]

No but you have to open the 464, the version is printed on the pcb.

cpc models on cpcwiki:

Mainboard Versions - CPCWiki

Ah never mind.  It says on the version 3 that the joystick and sound output bit were moved to the left.  Mine are on the back.

[opqa]

Having tried the 2k11, all Z80 images instantly starts up, but the TAP images doesn't. After selecting a TAP file, you have to manually type LOAD"" in the standard startup screen before it starts.

Yes, but that still means that there is some on-the-fly conversion being done directly on the 2K11 doesn't it? This could be done for the CPC too.

Maybe a silly question, but if you have to wait, What's the point? No special hardware needed, just connect your mobile phone to a tape adapter or use a tape mp3 adapter with SD card reader integrated...

And this is where it gets confusing again.  I don't what what Arkos or Snarkos is.  All I understanding about this ROM thing is that you can transfer games to it to load up instantly like a cartridge (or like how BASIC is there immediately when you switch on the CPC?).  How do you choose which game to load from the ROM?

Your understanding is right about the ROM's, just forget about SNArkos for a moment. X-MEM is a card in which you can "put" ROMS, this ROMS can be games (there is a list of games "converted" to run from ROM here) or "utilities".

The "problem" with your CPC is the following, you get your X-MEM and you want to start "putting" all this ROMS in it. How do you do it? Do you guess? Yes, the "standard" way is... via disk, which you don't have. When you buy an X-MEM they ship it to you with a 3.5" or 3" disk with the basic utilities to manage ROMS. Usually, to add new ROMs you put the .rom file in disc, load the utility, and use it to "upload it" to the X-MEM from the same CPC.

When I first wrote my message I thought that you had no way to transfer ROMS to the X-MEM, but since them a new idea has come to my mind. *Maybe*, there is a way to transfer ROMs to the X-MEM via a tape. I'm pretty sure you'll be able to transfer the X-MEM utilities to a tape and load them from there somehow, what I don't know is whether this utilities would be able to grab the .rom file from also from the tape instead of disk. If they use the firmware chances are they'll be. It would be a painfully slow transfer, but you would only have to do it once for each ROM. Unfortunately I don't have the hardware so I can't tell you for sure whether this is possible or not. If it is possible then you'd have enough to begin with just the X-MEM, you don't need the MiniBooster neither the MX4,  just ask for the appropriate cable to connect it directly to the expansion slot of your CPC (there are 2 different types).

On the other side, the MiniBooster is a hardware which lets you to establish communication between a CPC and a PC in a fast way, via a serial port.

And finally SNArkos is just a ROM, a ROM that has the ability to receive emulator snapshots from a PC via the MiniBooster and execute them on the real CPC. So you can load any game in an emulator, take a snapshot and send it to the CPC very fast via the MiniBooster to execute it. When I thought you didn't have any way to transfer ROMS by yourself to the X-MEM, I considered this was the only way you could use it. That's the reason I told you to ask the people who sell it to ship it with some pre-selection of ROMS already loaded. But it would be much better if you find a way to transfer any ROM you want by yourself.

[Carnivius]

Oh ok.  Hm.  Yeah no disks.   Maybe when I order a x-mem I can ask for certain fave games to be on it so I don't have to?  (I just checked the list and most of my fave games aren't on it).

When you say serial port on the minibooster, is that serial needed on the cpc or the pc?  Cos my pc is a laptop with no serial port.  Is all USB these days.

[TFM]

this is not the problem, who has a Symbiface (like me) has a mass storage solution, the problem is the ROM perfectly merged with AMSDOS for high compatibility, plus the modification of games that disconnect or overwrite the roms memory (#a600 and so on).

The solution is a good ROM and fat32 implementation for this mass storage solutions, and, i think that is in development with this new massive storage solutions...

Right! We need that for Amsdos / Firmware. It's nice if Symbos can do it, but where's the gain? The HxC can already use DSK images.

in fact, only with luck, the 1% of disc games, will work...

Well, I don't know what you're using. But as a matter of fact about 90% of my games run with the Dobbertin HD20 hard disc. I put all my favorite games on a 5 MB partition and they work like a charm.

[Joseman]

what rom are yo using? bonnydos? what version?
in my experience, the games that works are tinny games or games firmware friendly... and there isn't that much...

[TFM]

No, I'm using the Dobbertin HD20 hard disc with 20 MB (4 partitions of 5 MB) and X-DDOS.


Never touched Bonnydos and will not do, it's compatible to .... not much. And this would be for the SF2 anyway, not the HD20.


See here:
Dobbertin Harddisc - CPCWiki

[Joseman]

i see... what format for HD is used?  X-ddos patchs amsdos drive calls?

[TFM]

i see... what format for HD is used?  X-ddos patchs amsdos drive calls?

Yes, the disc firmware is patched, so it can be used like a floppy drive. Including RSX commands etc.


Format? Well, it has 17 sectors per track, each 512 bytes long, 4 cylinders, don't remember the number of tracks now... Like an XT hard disc, it's MFM.

[opqa]

When you say serial port on the minibooster, is that serial needed on the cpc or the pc?  Cos my pc is a laptop with no serial port.  Is all USB these days.

Nope, I told you, there are both USB-serial and Bluetooth serial adapters for that really cheap. The MiniBooster comes with a USB one and for 5€ more you can get the bluetooth module that you can plug directly in the same MiniBooster. The PC automatically detects this adapters (they use standard protocols) and create a virtual COM port you can use with any COM friendly software.


There is also another possibility to transfer ROMS to the X-MEM in a fast way via the minibooster. The Arkos ROM pack also includes a utility to transfer files from PC to disk. And the X-MEM with RAM expansion creates a kind of RAM drive compatible with the firmware to some extent.


You might be able to use both features to transfer ROM files via the minibooster to the RAM C drive and the upload them to a ROM slot from there. But I see all this combination more difficult to work. This utilities were not designed to work together and there will probably be problems at some stage.


Anyhow, if this utilities don't work together, maybe with access to the code and some small tweaking they could be fixed.

[opqa]

To complete, I have been investigating how the X-MEM gets programmed and making some tests within emulators and I've arrived to the following conclusions:

1) It should be perfectly possible to upload any ROM to the X-MEM via tape. But to make your life easier you should ask them send it to you configured with the original 464OS and for your keyboard layout. The "default" X-MEM config replaces the OS with another one that disables tape loading and adds this "|C" RAM drive. You could do this by yourself also via tape, but better if it gets shipped to you with the "right" config.

2) The other possibility, transferring files to this "C" drive via the MiniBooster using the Arkos ROM, as I feared it's not possible, the Arkos ROM is not compatible with the X-MEM's "|C" RAM drive. It shouldn't be difficult to code a utility to transfer files to this |C drive (or any other) from the PC via the MiniBooster, but I think that such utility doesn't exist yet. If someone is interested such utility would be really useful to any MiniBooster owner. Not just CPC464 owners.

(I just checked the list and most of my fave games aren't on it).

You might find some more in this thread:
Converting a game to ROM - and LOTS of ROM files inside!

An also, any game you can find in this ftp folder (and sub-folders), should be convertible to ROM:

Code Select Expand

ftp://amstrad:amstrad@amstrad.serveftp.com/Webs/Compactados por cngsoft/

Their particularity is that they have been cracked/modified to run from a single file. This are the kind of games that might be easily executed from future, past or present massive storage solutions, or from ROM, of from anywhere.