Damn postal services

CraigsBar · 19:56, 17 February 15

Hi guys.

OK first a very short rant about postal services. I just received in the post today a lower ROM board from @TotO. As you can see in the photos I think someone in the postal service trod in it. Rant over.

It was well wrapped in 3 layers of bubble wrap so this is clearly not a packing problem.

Now the support question...

What are the ratings on the LEDs. The green one certainly need a replacing and the red one is a bit bent too. I have spare pin headers and jumper headers so will unsolder and replace those, but will have to buy new LEDs so if anyone could advise of the rating I'd really appreciate it. Also I assume the button is Push to Make type for the reset, is this correct.

Craig.

00WReX · 21:45, 17 February 15

That's a mess.

By the time you have de-soldered all the damaged bits you are almost going to have a blank PCB.

The LEDs are just standard 3mm items as far as I am aware.

Here is an example of the specs.

red
LED - Basic Red 3mm - COM-00533 - SparkFun Electronics

green
LED - Basic Green 3mm - COM-09650 - SparkFun Electronics

All the best with the fixup.

Cheers,
Shane

TotO · 22:17, 17 February 15

Bufff.... I don't know what to said when I see that.

roy bates · 22:22, 17 February 15

leds are bog standard bud,just measure the size of them they are really easy and cheap to get the switch is most likely a push to make tactile nothing hard to get.

like this,just pick a stem size that suites you:)

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/10-x-Momentary-Tactile-Switch-Push-Button-Miniature-Mini-Micro-PCB-SPST-/281245089820?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&var=&hash=item417b83801c

it looks worse than it actually is:) as long as the board itself is undamaged it will be fairly cheap to fix mate.

ive actually fixed computers in worse state than that board...but,i suppose thats not he point.

TotO · 22:25, 17 February 15

I can send you all the parts I think.

CraigsBar · 22:37, 17 February 15

Quote from: TotO on 22:25, 17 February 15
I can send you all the parts I think.

no worries about that mate, I'll source them locally, I just wanted to know the spec. At least the board is undamaged.

Craig

Bryce · 09:54, 18 February 15

Hi Craig,
what a mess. The header pins should be saveable by just bending them back up. The LEDs are bog standard 3mm low-current LEDs, but you have to stay with Red, Green or Yellow. Using Blue or white LEDs will cause problems. The button is a push to make.

Bryce.

TFM · 20:58, 18 February 15

Terrible this "Royal Mail". Happened to me before when trying to get stuff from the UK and eventually just got broken crumbs. A lot of sad, incompetent or just psychopathic people must work there.

It hurts to see that pictures.

CraigsBar · 20:36, 25 February 15

OK, all fixed.

I had to use Low Power normal size LED's because there seems to be a shortage of mini ones in Galway, and the button is 2 leg not 4, but it is quite stable and works well.

Here it is mounted in its new home, on my spare Symbiface.

I wonder how many people can say they have a *spare* symbiface.

Although whilst testing this before and after seating the Lower rom board in place I noticed that the RAM/ROM PLD (IC 11) gets damn hot. something that does not happen on my in use Symbiface, have any of you clever hardware guys got any ideas as to why this might happen?

Thanks in advance,

Craig

Terje_Norway · 21:01, 25 February 15

Quote from: CraigsBar on 20:36, 25 February 15

...

I wonder how many people can say they have a *spare* symbiface.

...

Craig

Hi,

I think I do beat You well on this part of the subject

When I made my order for Symbiface II (a looong time ago), I did order FOUR of them

This simply due to the fact that it would probably be a limited production (I guess I was right), and IF something went wrong it would be nice to have a few spares laying around.
So I have one Symbiface II connected to a CPC6128. One spare laying around UNUSED, and two of them seems to have a blown up consensators.
It was a bit difficult to connect the PSU to the Symbiface board. The choosen solution wasn't the smartest IMHO

Anyway the "broken" boards will probably take a trip to Bryce at a later stage ! ! !

Yours

Terje Grind
NORWAY

pelrun · 06:42, 26 February 15

Quote from: CraigsBar on 20:36, 25 February 15
Although whilst testing this before and after seating the Lower rom board in place I noticed that the RAM/ROM PLD (IC 11) gets damn hot. something that does not happen on my in use Symbiface, have any of you clever hardware guys got any ideas as to why this might happen?

This is a bit confusing. So you're seeing the chip get hot on the Symbiface with the LowerROM board in place, but not the other one? Does it stop when you remove the LowerROM? You've probably got a short or a near short somewhere, putting a lot more current through the PLD.

TotO · 08:17, 26 February 15

Quote from: CraigsBar on 20:36, 25 February 15
Although whilst testing this before and after seating the Lower rom board in place I noticed that the RAM/ROM PLD (IC 11) gets damn hot. something that does not happen on my in use Symbiface, have any of you clever hardware guys got any ideas as to why this might happen?

Try to use the other LowerBoard on it... If that not append, that mean your board was not properly fixed and a short-cut exist.
Take case, because that should damage some of your SFII parts.

CraigsBar · 11:03, 26 February 15

Quote from: pelrun on 06:42, 26 February 15

This is a bit confusing. So you're seeing the chip get hot on the Symbiface with the LowerROM board in place, but not the other one? Does it stop when you remove the LowerROM? You've probably got a short or a near short somewhere, putting a lot more current through the PLD.

Hi pelrun,

Thanks for your reply, the ic gets hot with or without the lower rom board. It was getting warm last time I used it, long before I had the lower ROM board. However since this is a spare sf2 I was not too bothered. I can see me needing to use it in the not too distant future and yesterday it got hot, not just warm. so would like it fixed if possible. As I have no testing kit, skill or knowledge in troubleshooting electronics I dunno where to go. I cannot see any obvious shorts on either side of the PCB, but it is pretty tight around those 2 PLDs.

Craig

Bryce · 11:40, 26 February 15

Hi Craig,
I've fixed a few SFII in the past and found that some had rather hot CPLDs and others didn't. There was no obvious external reason for the CPLDs to get hot and the SFII was working properly so I didn't investigate further. It may be a mistake in the CPLD code or a faulty part. However, DrZed never released the source code for the chip, so I have no way of copying or replacing the part.

Bryce.

CraigsBar · 13:06, 26 February 15

Quote from: Bryce on 11:40, 26 February 15
Hi Craig,
I've fixed a few SFII in the past and found that some had rather hot CPLDs and others didn't. There was no obvious external reason for the CPLDs to get hot and the SFII was working properly so I didn't investigate further. It may be a mistake in the CPLD code or a faulty part. However, DrZed never released the source code for the chip, so I have no way of copying or replacing the part.

Bryce.

I guess I'll get a small heatsink on it to try and keep it cooler then.

OK, so perhaps I could swap the PLDs in my sf2's over and see if the heating swaps with the chips. If so at least I know where the issue is.

Is there no way to read a PLD and duplicate it without the source? Damn!

Craig

Bryce · 13:43, 26 February 15

That would be a good idea, then you'll at least know whether the problem is the board or the CPLD.

It is possible to read out a CPLD, unless of course the protection bit has been set. The fact that DrZed didn't release the schematic, layout or code would suggest that the write-protection has been set, but I haven't tried it. I have Impact and a Xilinx Jtag programmer here, so I could try, but I don't have an SFII.

Bryce.

TotO · 14:16, 26 February 15

I post again, but... Is the problem exist with your other LowerBoard?

Bryce · 14:21, 26 February 15

Quote from: TotO on 14:16, 26 February 15
I post again, but... Is the problem exist with your other LowerBoard?

?? Craig already stated that the problem even exists when NO LowerROMBoard is attached. So the hot CPLD has nothing to do with the LowerROMBoard.

Bryce.

CraigsBar · 14:40, 26 February 15

Quote from: Bryce on 14:21, 26 February 15
?? Craig already stated that the problem even exists when NO LowerROMBoard is attached. So the hot CPLD has nothing to do with the LowerROMBoard.

Bryce.

and the lower ROM board works perfectly on it's own, with the other symbiface and with this one. The issue is purely with the ram/ROM PLD. Will swap them tonight. And see if the heat moves with the ic, or stays on the board.

TotO · 14:42, 26 February 15

OK!

gerald · 15:05, 26 February 15

Are the two symbiface from the same batch ?
I remember that the latest batch was late because they had to change one of the pld source, and this caused timing problems.
It can also be that one pld is programmed with power save option and the other not.

CraigsBar · 15:17, 26 February 15

They were ordered separately. And one if them was replaced as it was DOA.

But it is all a long time ago and I cannot remember which is which. I'll check the serial numbers tonight and see if I can work it out.

CraigsBar · 21:11, 26 February 15

Quote from: Bryce on 13:43, 26 February 15
That would be a good idea, then you'll at least know whether the problem is the board or the CPLD.

It is possible to read out a CPLD, unless of course the protection bit has been set. The fact that DrZed didn't release the schematic, layout or code would suggest that the write-protection has been set, but I haven't tried it. I have Impact and a Xilinx Jtag programmer here, so I could try, but I don't have an SFII.

Bryce.

Well the heat is PLD specific.

I have not tried my Main PLD in the Spare PCB, But when the Spare PLD is in the Main Symbiface, it warms up, when the it's own PLD in in the socket there is no warm up. so I guess it is PLD related.

Is it worth you think testing my Normal (Not Hot) PLD in the spare PCB?

I had a good look at the PCB's and they are both the same revision number, But the Spare (hot) one has an extra Diode on the bottom. of the board by the Power supply, This is not present on my Main Symbiface, At this rate I will be sending them Both to @Bryce (Or anyone else offering service - Just not Redspot Games) to see if

1. The RAM/ROM IC is protected
2. The purpose of the extra Diode
3. If the heating issue can be prevented

Regards

Craig.

TFM · 21:59, 26 February 15

Quote from: CraigsBar on 21:11, 26 February 15
1. The RAM/ROM IC is protected

Hi Craig,

Well, both the RAM and the Pseudo-ROM is made out of Static RAMs on the SF2. There is no protection for neither one of them as I know.

How to program into the battery backed up S-RAM for the ROM simulator is written nicely in the CPCWiki and you can of course use the SF2 ROManager.

I wished I could help you more.

Bryce · 09:10, 27 February 15

Quote from: CraigsBar on 21:11, 26 February 15
I have not tried my Main PLD in the Spare PCB, But when the Spare PLD is in the Main Symbiface, it warms up, when the it's own PLD in in the socket there is no warm up. so I guess it is PLD related.

Yes, looks like it's "warming itself up" then. They must have changed something in the code between versions?
You can send them over if you like, but there's not much I can do with them. I certainly can't reduce the heat problem (other than slapping a heatsink onto it, which you could also do yourself). I (or someone else) can probably tell you what the diode does just from decent photos of the top/bottom of the PCB and as TFM said, the RAM/ROM can't be write-protected, it's just SRAM.

Bryce.

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