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Any game for CPC+ that support analogue joystick?

Started by mr_lou, 18:58, 25 October 13

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Puresox

Quote from: TFM on 16:29, 10 December 13

It was not c64 or spectrum or Jupiter Ace compatible either.


But the CPC Joystick port provides access for actually two joysticks with three fire buttons each! And this is great!  :)


This business regarding 3 fire buttons, I guess this does not mean 3 different fire options? so you could map jump, fire and fire 2? 

TFM

Yes, it's three separated buttons. You could use them for fire, bomb and laser for example. It's three separated inputs.  :)
TFM of FutureSoft
Also visit the CPC and Plus users favorite OS: FutureOS - The Revolution on CPC6128 and 6128Plus

Puresox


TFM

Doesn't matter if Plus or oG. All CPC have three fire buttons.  :)
TFM of FutureSoft
Also visit the CPC and Plus users favorite OS: FutureOS - The Revolution on CPC6128 and 6128Plus

arnoldemu

Quote from: TFM on 22:08, 10 December 13
Doesn't matter if Plus or oG. All CPC have three fire buttons.  :)
plus has only 2 fire buttons, third is not connected?
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TotO

No "fire 3", as no track goes to the pin 5 on the plus main board.
"You make one mistake in your life and the internet will never let you live it down" (Keith Goodyer)

Puresox


TotO

First... Why the fire 2 button was not used in games. (3rd button if not official)
Because, joysticks with 2 fire buttons was always linked together on CPC, ST, Amiga controllers... To make more money.
"You make one mistake in your life and the internet will never let you live it down" (Keith Goodyer)

TFM

Quote from: TotO on 22:15, 10 December 13
No "fire 3", as no track goes to the pin 5 on the plus main board.


Right! I remember I had to solder that in by myself, it's quite easy though.

TFM of FutureSoft
Also visit the CPC and Plus users favorite OS: FutureOS - The Revolution on CPC6128 and 6128Plus

TFM

Quote from: TotO on 23:28, 10 December 13
First... Why the fire 2 button was not used in games. (3rd button if not official)
Because, joysticks with 2 fire buttons was always linked together on CPC, ST, Amiga controllers... To make more money.


Sad but true. However a couple of games [nb]No, I'm not talking about my prods ;-)[/nb] did use both.
TFM of FutureSoft
Also visit the CPC and Plus users favorite OS: FutureOS - The Revolution on CPC6128 and 6128Plus

TotO

Old games allow to define keys, and play with 2 buttons.
But, some need patchs too... Like Ikari Warrior as it don't want to use fire2 as "toggle".

You can see here, how to restaure a JY-2 for working better and making the 2 fires buttons independents. (in french)
(the passthrough connector can be used with a 2 fire button GX4000 pads too)

For me, the 8bit systems are 2 fire buttons friendly as ARCADE, NES, SMS, PCE, ... Always made great games with that.
The 3rd CPC fire line, if used, might be for an optional action (menu, pause, ...) that must be done on the keyboard too.
"You make one mistake in your life and the internet will never let you live it down" (Keith Goodyer)

TFM

Agreed. However I prefer to press Fire 3 on my joystick instead of moving the hand to the keyboard. Therefore I converted some joysticks with three buttons, so I can use Fire 1, 2 and 3. Honestly Fire 3 is not used that often.[nb]Works nice even as AMX mouse replacement with Stop Press f.e.[/nb]  :laugh:
TFM of FutureSoft
Also visit the CPC and Plus users favorite OS: FutureOS - The Revolution on CPC6128 and 6128Plus

TotO

If I remember well, on R-Type that allow to pause the game. (and pressing 1+2 while pausing exit to the menu)
But this 3rd button is only available on hacked controllers... So, it's just for fun and no CPC game have to use it for the main gameplay.
"You make one mistake in your life and the internet will never let you live it down" (Keith Goodyer)

TFM

Would be nice to have a Wiki page which lists all progs using all three buttons (for whatever).


And a second list of progs which allow you to redefine keyboard in a way that allows to usage of Fire 3.


Maybe the same for Fire 2.
TFM of FutureSoft
Also visit the CPC and Plus users favorite OS: FutureOS - The Revolution on CPC6128 and 6128Plus

Anthony Flack

It is disappointing to look up the analogue port and see that it was used for basically nothing and still hasn't really been put to use. Especially since it's apparently compatible with PC analogue sticks? There must be some games out there that would benefit from analogue controls. Elite; Star Wars/Star Strike; Space Harrier... seems like a fun thing to mess around with. 

Presumably it's also compatible with PC steering wheels of the era which IIRC simply put analogue x on the wheel, analogue y+ on gas and analogue y- on brake, with gear up and down on button 1 and 2.

Dan Gorlin (Choplifter developer) back in the 80s said that he wasn't interested in any games that didn't have analogue control. A Plus version of Choplifter, with controls as Dan intended could be a worthwhile project. Or a Plus version of Typhoon Thompson, if someone was feeling extremely ambitious... 

dthrone

I think if there was an analogue thumbstick readily available it would definitely open up some opportunities.  Full size analogue sticks are horrible to use for anything other than flight games imo but obviously your suggestions fall into the right category in that regard!

TotO

The analog port reuse some existing signals. It is common for the two players:

Player1:
1- GND
2- FIRE1
3- RX1
4- COM1
6- RY1
7- FIRE2

Player2:
 9- GND
10- FIRE1
11- RX2
12- COM2
13- RY2
14- FIRE2

5 = VCC
8 = GND

If used for on player only, it provide 4 action buttons and two analog sticks.
The digital U/D/L/R signals can be hooked from the joystick ports.
"You make one mistake in your life and the internet will never let you live it down" (Keith Goodyer)

dthrone

Quote from: TotO on 13:38, 28 March 23The analog port reuse some existing signals. It is common for the two players:

Player1:
1- GND
2- FIRE1
3- RX1
4- COM1
6- RY1
7- FIRE2

Player2:
 9- GND
10- FIRE1
11- RX2
12- COM2
13- RY2
14- FIRE2

5 = VCC
8 = GND

If used for on player only, it provide 4 action buttons and two analog sticks.
The digital U/D/L/R signals can be hooked from the joystick ports.

haha, ripe for a dual analog controller with shoulder buttons?  

TotO

@dthrone I though about that.

@Duke What about an "Imperial Duo" dock to connect together the 2x DB9 + 1x DB15 to dual USB-A / USB-C ports?
"You make one mistake in your life and the internet will never let you live it down" (Keith Goodyer)

Anthony Flack

I've been looking for an old PC joystick to mess around with, and they are cheap enough but I just can't find one for sale in my country right now and don't want to pay $60 postage on a $10 joystick. There must be 15 pin joysticks sitting around in garages everywhere though; they were common enough in the late 90s... X-Wing vs Tie Fighter must have sold a few

dthrone

They are definitely about, here in the UK you might get a lucky find at a car boot sale or a 2nd hand gaming store etc.  Their bulk means ebay can be quite costly due to postage.

Also see https://www.cpcwiki.eu/index.php/Analog_Joysticks if you haven't already.  The AJ-5 is the holy grail.

andycadley

Would there really be much benefit to an analog joystick in most 8-bit 2D games, though? I always thought it seemed a somewhat niche idea and possibly because Amstrad was expecting to have a batch of joysticks it could dump into a bundle along the lines.

Now if you combined both digital joystick interfaces into one, you'd have enough button inputs to wire up a SNES controller, which would be a much more promising option, IMO.

dthrone

Quote from: andycadley on 08:34, 31 March 23Would there really be much benefit to an analog joystick in most 8-bit 2D games, though? I always thought it seemed a somewhat niche idea and possibly because Amstrad was expecting to have a batch of joysticks it could dump into a bundle along the lines.

Now if you combined both digital joystick interfaces into one, you'd have enough button inputs to wire up a SNES controller, which would be a much more promising option, IMO.
I agree that it's very niche for 2D!  Erm... struggling a bit.  It might work well for something like Angry Birds.  A track and field type game (shot put?)  Mario Party-esque mini games.  Obvs flight games.  Brainstorm over  :-\

roudoudou

Quote from: andycadley on 08:34, 31 March 23Would there really be much benefit to an analog joystick in most 8-bit 2D games, though? I always thought it seemed a somewhat niche idea and possibly because Amstrad was expecting to have a batch of joysticks it could dump into a bundle along the lines.

Now if you combined both digital joystick interfaces into one, you'd have enough button inputs to wire up a SNES controller, which would be a much more promising option, IMO.

We want Bubble Quest support for analog joystick, it make sense as there is a physical engine. It will change the way to driving the bubble in the maze (wont be mandatory of course)

I made at home some tests with wires and potentiometer ;D
My pronouns are RASM and ACE

Sykobee (Briggsy)

Hmm, will a PC analogue joystick work? https://www.cpcwiki.eu/index.php/Connector:Analogue_joystick_(CPC_Plus_only) says there are some differences, in particular the buttons need to be attached to a select line, not GND (probably because they also exchanged VCC and GND).

So you'll need the Amstrad or Sinclair analogue joystick, or maybe an adapter for PC ones.

And the analogue buttons are mapped to the digital buttons, you can't have a system using both for separate actions.

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