Author Topic: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?  (Read 2862 times)

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Offline Bryce

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #25 on: 00:34, 05 May 20 »
Yes, but actually, accuracy isn't black and white either. Accuracy should always have a tolerance, ie: you usually speak of "accurate to x%" or when it comes to electrical measurements "accurate to x% plus x counts". So it's not really the "pregnant / not pregnant" situation.

In your profession, if you were to measure a temperature the result could be 22.57°C and some may call that accurate, but for someone else without knowing what number comes after the 7 means that it's not accurate.

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Offline GUNHED

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #26 on: 00:49, 05 May 20 »
How easy are bits and bytes then.  :)
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Offline Bryce

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #27 on: 09:35, 05 May 20 »
Relatively easy. :D (and sort of accurate)

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #28 on: 10:09, 05 May 20 »
Why am I getting the impression that I'm watching a T-Rex and a Raptor circling each other here?  ;)

Offline GUNHED

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #29 on: 14:19, 05 May 20 »
A T-Rex? That was a great hardware CPC emulator, sadly due to crazy EU laws it's not available in EU any longer.


Raptor? Do you mean the C-One?  :laugh:
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Offline mr.freeze

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #30 on: 19:12, 10 May 20 »
Doh! Up to now I've passed the Turing test with flying colours, only to be outed by you!!!

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Offline mr.freeze

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #31 on: 19:17, 10 May 20 »
Nobody interested by a Pascal cross-compiler for Z80 ?

Offline reidrac

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #32 on: 20:14, 10 May 20 »
That ship sailed for me late 90s when I decided to learn C instead of Pascal :)
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Offline JonB

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #33 on: 20:38, 10 May 20 »
Pascal sux.

C rocks.

Z80 pwns all.

Nuff said.

Offline mr.freeze

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #34 on: 20:45, 10 May 20 »
I think programs written in Pascal are prettier than those written in C. And don't talk me about Object Pascal.

I switched to C++ in the meantime but I still admire the beauty of well written Pascal programs.

Offline mr.freeze

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #35 on: 22:04, 10 May 20 »
So, If that's the way it is, I will focus my work first on the 8086 DOS version as I know it best while listening Wooden Ships by CSNY.

Offline JonB

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #36 on: 14:09, 12 May 20 »
We all have our favourite programming language(s).. My view is that it is possible to write horrible looking code in any language, and that includes Pascal and C / C++. The trick with it is to lay it out consistently, with good commentary. A good, clearly commented piece of code draws you in; whereas a crappy ill commented badly laid out program tends to repel. Design it properly and keep it simple. (Do I really need to use that obscure language feature or design pattern, or am I just trying to look clever?) And who knows, it might be you maintaining it a few years after writing - as happened to me several times during my programming career..

Offline GUNHED

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #37 on: 14:52, 12 May 20 »
Nobody interested by a Pascal cross-compiler for Z80 ?
Pascal, maybe yes, but cross compiler no. Do it on the target hardware.  :)
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Offline mr.freeze

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #38 on: 17:36, 17 May 20 »
Pascal, maybe yes, but cross compiler no. Do it on the target hardware.  :)
I intended to test the compiler by compiling it by itself, targeting an emulator or my NC100 and do the same on the target machine :-)

The Z80 version of Pascal-P4, should fit in 80K, I think. 32K will be needed for self-compilation (stack+heap+data). So this should be possible on a machine with 128K of free RAM. But don't expect compilation speed higher than 10 lines by seconds.
I'm working on the 8086 version and also busy decompiling a 26 year old program I wrote in TP7 of which I lost the source code.




Offline mr.freeze

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #39 on: 17:41, 17 May 20 »
We all have our favourite programming language(s).. My view is that it is possible to write horrible looking code in any language, and that includes Pascal and C / C++. The trick with it is to lay it out consistently, with good commentary. A good, clearly commented piece of code draws you in; whereas a crappy ill commented badly laid out program tends to repel. Design it properly and keep it simple. (Do I really need to use that obscure language feature or design pattern, or am I just trying to look clever?) And who knows, it might be you maintaining it a few years after writing - as happened to me several times during my programming career..
I couldn't agree more. But I think a beautiful program written in Pascal is prettier than one written in C :-P

Offline GUNHED

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #40 on: 20:06, 17 May 20 »
Well, if compiling time is slow it doesn't kill. The first thing is to make it working. After that it can be optimized. And I'm sure the Z80 can be more or less as quick as an 8086.  :)
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Offline tjohnson

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #41 on: 12:14, 18 May 20 »
I learnt Turbo Pascal at college in the early 90s and enjoyed it as a language, it just seemed to fit the way my mind worked or maybe it was just the way it was taught.  It's a highly structured language so maybe that was part of it.

Offline AMSDOS

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #42 on: 09:27, 20 May 20 »
Nobody interested by a Pascal cross-compiler for Z80 ?


I fear it's a lot of work, just to satisify a small group.  >:( 


Part of my reason for start writing a small BASIC-like language, was to throw in some of the useful commands and to look at the difficult though important core ingredients (WHILE, IF, FOR, LET) of the language.
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Offline mr.freeze

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #43 on: 17:55, 20 May 20 »
I fear it's a lot of work, just to satisify a small group.  >:( 
Actually, I'm writing a P-code to Z80 compiler, which is easier than writing a compiler for a high-level language from scratch. The P-code is generated by Pascal-P4 described at https://homepages.cwi.nl/~steven/pascal/. I hope to provide you with an acceptable release soon. Currently, the prototype is written mainly in Sed and Awk and it's quite trashy, so I need to rewrite it cleanly, in Pascal, while I'm ahead.

I've ported Pascal-P4 to Free Pascal and Delphi a few years ago and published my work on the defunct Berlios. The project is available on Github : https://github.com/BackupTheBerlios/pp4fpc but I don't have any control on it.

Offline AMSDOS

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #44 on: 13:33, 24 May 20 »
I get warnings from that homepages link that the Certificate was written by someone not to be trusted :o
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Offline mr.freeze

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #45 on: 17:57, 24 May 20 »
I get warnings from that homepages link that the Certificate was written by someone not to be trusted :o

Check if your browser and OS are up to date. Comodo/Setcigo has changed its SSL root certificate a year ago or so, it could be that.

Pascal-S would deserve a look. A compiler/interpreter for a subset of Pascal, easier to read than Pascal-P. This could be a good starting point for a compiler written entirely in Z80, which would be much faster and more compact.

Offline Bryce

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #46 on: 22:02, 24 May 20 »
I got that error recently when my PC clock wasn't synced properly.

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Offline AMSDOS

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #47 on: 03:22, 25 May 20 »
Check if your browser and OS are up to date. Comodo/Setcigo has changed its SSL root certificate a year ago or so, it could be that.

Pascal-S would deserve a look. A compiler/interpreter for a subset of Pascal, easier to read than Pascal-P. This could be a good starting point for a compiler written entirely in Z80, which would be much faster and more compact.


Seems to be fine on my phone, so suspect the computer is misinforming me. Trouble is it's an old computer and I still regularly use the CD-ROM on it, but I was warned last year that I'd need to upgrade soon, but all the new computers don't have the CD-ROM!!
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Offline mr.freeze

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Re: Cor. It's a bit quiet in here innit..?
« Reply #48 on: 18:18, 29 May 20 »

Seems to be fine on my phone, so suspect the computer is misinforming me. Trouble is it's an old computer and I still regularly use the CD-ROM on it, but I was warned last year that I'd need to upgrade soon, but all the new computers don't have the CD-ROM!!
My main computer is a used Thinkpad T430 from 2012 with a 3rd gen i5 bought a year ago for nothing, it has an integrated DVD writer and, it is faster than my i3 4th gen Asus bought 4 years ago and largely suits my needs. the Intel HD4000 GPU is sufficient for Netflix also.