Analogue joystick testing

[dthrone]

It's been ages since anyone has posted about this so I've started a new topic.  Now I've got my C4CPC I've been able to test a Quickshot Blackhawk (model QS-6219) analogue joystick on a GX4000 using the Arnold Diagnostic cart.
I firstly tested the pins, both fire buttons are connected to pin 4 as required, so the digital buttons are good.  Both axis pins are connected to pin 1, so there is no problem there (nothing for the reversed 0/5V to destroy).
I didn't bother checking the resistance ranges because I don't have enough hands.
The nice thing is this joystick has two small sliders "x axis adjust" and "y axis adjust".  I plugged the joystick straight in and the sliders gave centred ranges 1a-27 in x and 1c-2b in y.  By tweaking the centred value, the full physical x and y ranges were available within 00-3F ASIC ranges.
So in conclusion this is an example of a analogue joystick that works perfectly on the GX4000, straight out of the box.

[dthrone]

Further to this, it would be nice to build up a table of analogue joysticks tested with the diagnostic cartridge, probably with at least make/model and x and y ranges recorded.

This would -
a) serve as a buying guide, the more sticks we know work, the more buying choice there is.  The more buying choice, the more owners, the more likely people will produce analogue stick compatible games 
b) let developers know what to account for when writing calibration routines etc.

Note, be sure to read the wiki guidelines before doing any tests.

Wiki has now been updated with a table on the analogue stick page.  It would be very nice to get a range of sticks tried out.  Post if unsure technically or wary of damage etc. 

[TFM]

I never used the Diagnostic cartridge. What I do is to start FutureOS (Plus version) and see if I can move the mouse pointer (hardware sprite) over the screen. Using the analogue joystick. IMHO the big advantage is that one can see the proportional speed in real-time. So one can assess who good the proportional part of the joystick actually is. 

[dthrone]

I never used the Diagnostic cartridge. What I do is to start FutureOS (Plus version) and see if I can move the mouse pointer (hardware sprite) over the screen. Using the analogue joystick. IMHO the big advantage is that one can see the proportional speed in real-time. So one can assess who good the proportional part of the joystick actually is. 

Well that's true, you certainly can't argue with the compatibility by seeing it in action 

So can you confirm any makes/models that have worked well in FutureOS (Plus)? 

[TFM]

Well that's true, you certainly can't argue with the compatibility by seeing it in action 
So can you confirm any makes/models that have worked well in FutureOS (Plus)? 

Thanks. Well, tbh, I only had the change to get one joystick to test. It was a cheap PC joystick they sold for cheap long time ago.
Once somebody here posted a picture in the forum, but I don't find the thread now. Sorry, that's not so helpful.

[dthrone]

Thanks. Well, tbh, I only had the change to get one joystick to test. It was a cheap PC joystick they sold for cheap long time ago.
Once somebody here posted a picture in the forum, but I don't find the thread now. Sorry, that's not so helpful.

A while ago I did read through those threads, I'll have to take another look and see if anything useful can be extracted 

I am quite sure that many people are starting plus cart projects now the C4CPC is available, and I'm sure most would like the confidence that if they include analogue stick functionality, users will have plenty of mod-free solutions 

[Bryce]

The software is irrelevant, it's the hardware that needs to be tested for compatibility, but I will agree, the Future OS cursor is a good way to test it.

Bryce.

[CraigsBar]

The software is irrelevant, it's the hardware that needs to be tested for compatibility, but I will agree, the Future OS cursor is a good way to test it.

Bryce.

any chance of a proper USB mouse to analogue socket eh @Bryce ?

[dthrone]

The software is irrelevant, it's the hardware that needs to be tested for compatibility, but I will agree, the Future OS cursor is a good way to test it.

Bryce.

With all these testing options available, hopefully some more makes/models can be confirmed. 

....or even ruled out! 

[Bryce]

any chance of a proper USB mouse to analogue socket eh @Bryce ?

Technically possible, but how many people would really want one?

Bryce.

[CraigsBar]

Me for sure, 2 actually. If it is truly analogue and I am sure @TFM and @Prodatron will be able to add support to futureos and symbos. Oh an maybe a Cyber-Chicken patch lol.

[Bryce]

Me for sure, 2 actually. If it is truly analogue and I am sure @TFM and @Prodatron will be able to add support to futureos and symbos. Oh an maybe a Cyber-Chicken patch lol.

Don't they already support analogue joysticks as pointing devices? The OS wouldn't know whether it's a joystick or a USB mouse adapter.

Bryce.

[CraigsBar]

Futures does, not sure about symbos.... I've not got an analogue stick to test with.

[dthrone]

Futures does, not sure about symbos.... I've not got an analogue stick to test with.

Well you now know that if you pick up a Quickshot QS-6219 from ebay or wherever you'll have one you can use 


That's the whole point of this topic - to make it easy to pick one up 

[TFM]

Me for sure, 2 actually. If it is truly analogue and I am sure @TFM and @Prodatron will be able to add support to futureos and symbos. Oh an maybe a Cyber-Chicken patch lol.

From the FutureOS side it already works. 

[dthrone]

Technically possible, but how many people would really want one?

Bryce.

Mouse adaptor = potential for cart god games, point+click etc., I'm sure plenty of people would want one then 

[CraigsBar]

Mouse adaptor = potential for cart god games, point+click etc., I'm sure plenty of people would want one then 

Ditto!


And Image a Plus only Cart release of Cyber Chicken with proper analogue mouse support for more people than just those with a Symbiface II


Step 1, the Analogue Mouse adaptor
Step 2, Asking mouse orientated games to be ported to use it..... and other plus features... all no possible with C4CPC

[dthrone]

Step 2, Asking mouse orientated games to be ported to use it..... and other plus features... all no possible with C4CPC

Step 2.1, GX4000/plus exclusives too 

And Image a Plus only Cart release of Cyber Chicken with proper analogue mouse support for more people than just those with a Symbiface II

Would be very nice 

[andycadley]

I'd definitely buy a couple. Not the faintest idea what I'd actually do with them, but that never stopped me before! 

[TFM]

Ok, I would take 1-2 too, just to support and make tests. 

[dthrone]

Well I'd definitely have one, I've been going a bit GX4000 peripheral crazy recently 

[Bryce]

I'll add it to my list of projects that I'll probably never get around to doing

Bryce.

[MacDeath]

Where is the dislike button ?

I tested different Joystick/joypads that would use the same analog port 'DB15) that I have for my old PCs... via Tennis Cup II as it actually enables Analog controllers.
None worked... could only go up-left diagonal... but with proper drivers, I guess many controllers would actually work.

[dthrone]

I tested different Joystick/joypads that would use the same analog port 'DB15) that I have for my old PCs... via Tennis Cup II as it actually enables Analog controllers.
None worked... could only go up-left diagonal... but with proper drivers, I guess many controllers would actually work.

Finally some stick feedback 


The Tennis Cup II routine checks at almost the extremes of the ADC register ranges so it is likely that some of your sticks simply don't fill the full range because of their resistor values.  They will work, like you say with proper drivers.  In fact it would be extremely easy to patch TCII to make it work with a much larger range of sticks.


If you can test any of them with the Arnold Diagnostic cart and record the results it would be extremely useful information.  Drivers in games should be made accommodate the widest possible range of sticks.

[MacDeath]

I remember that it gave strange result on a PLUS in Basic... like chains of numbers/letters.
But I don't have the cartridge at the moment so I can't test for now.