Best cpc game

[AMSDOS]

TFM/FS wrote:

Yeah, but not more than four in one scanline (excluding the border).

That's true, still it's a neat trick and there's no flicker!    But then I'm a bit biased when it comes to stuff Ocean did! Not that I worked for them or anything!

[TFM]

TFM/FS wrote:

Yeah, but not more than four in one scanline (excluding the border).

That's true, still it's a neat trick and there's no flicker!    But then I'm a bit biased when it comes to stuff Ocean did! Not that I worked for them or anything!

Right, no flickering, sign for good timing. About Ocean, the had some good, and more bad IMHO. Nooooo, don't beat me up!

[Xyphoe]

Right, no flickering, sign for good timing. About Ocean, the had some good, and more bad IMHO. Nooooo, don't beat me up!

They were probably the most 'professional' games company, even if the game wasn't too impressive or fun it was usually put together well and presented nicely.

[AMSDOS]

TFM/FS wrote:

Right, no flickering, sign for good timing. About Ocean, the had some good, and more bad IMHO. Nooooo, don't beat me up!

LOL!    I downloaded NOMAD yesterday, certainly not one of their better ones, but it's just a funny game, the Sound FXs everything Firing and the sound of that piece of crap you fly around in just totally kills me laughing - it's a sluggish ship to control and occasionally it gets really hard! But I don't know I still love it. It's supposed to have Music in the game too, but I've never heard it! I thought this seems like the sort of thing one would have written using Laser BASIC, lots of Screens are used - the title screen and then one for the game itself with the game in a Window. Not much, but for some reason I find it very amusing to play! 

[redbox]

About Ocean, the had some good

Good..?!  Renegade and Gryzor were both amazing.

The programmers were using some really cool techniques and that was back in 1987.  Just a shame they didn't ever get the scrolling working and had to use flip screens (but I expect they tried and probably found out it was just too difficult on the old generation CPCs).

[TFM]

Sorry Redbox, but scrolling is soooooooooo easy! Even in overscan.

You just need two OUT instructions to scroll, if they can't to that then they shall go back to programming in LOGO with turtle graphics    Don't get me wrong, they're a commercial company and they want hard money for their products, to - damn it - they're supposed to deliver appropriate quality. Look at misson Genocide or TTL, that's scrolling!

As I said they had some good games and countless games of medicore to lower quality.


BTW: Renegade is from Imagine/Taito

BTW2: Take a look at this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o8ei0F1Xg1I

[redbox]

Sorry Redbox, but scrolling is soooooooooo easy! Even in overscan.
You just need two OUT instructions to scroll, if they can't to that then they shall go back to programming in LOGO with turtle graphics 

You're right, scrolling the screen by altering the CRTC is easy...

The hard part is the fact it scrolls 1 character (2 pixels in MODE 0) at a time, the awkward manner in which the CPC stores pixel data, the annoying layout of the screen memory, the wrap around that occurs and the overhead involved in re-calculating new screen addresses for everything once you've scrolled and so on.

I'm sure they tried it and it was only with time that people worked out ways of doing it effectively.  And despite all this, Renegade and Gryzor are both still great games on the CPC.

[MacDeath]

And despite all this, Renegade and Gryzor are both still great games on the CPC.

Because all the stuff they didn't put into a decent Scrolling were put into the graphics, sounds too (good music on both) and good playability (sprite managment...it works well and smooth concerning sprites...)


Yet Renegade annoyed me because can't play 2 co-op.... and Blue Blood lol...
I wondered why ? but I thought only recently : "oh yeah, it was censored..."


That's why games like Ikary Warrior, Target Renegade, Rampage or Barbarian 1 were so great to me...
They had Co-op mode...very important when you have a greater Brother who used to keep the CPC for himself...

But Bombjack 1&2 were also amongst my faves...

Bombjack 1 because the maniability is so sweet, I simply can't find any other Bombjack verion that react like the CPC, and always prefer the CPC feeling...even compared to the original Arcade.
despite lesser graphics for CPC.

Bombjack 2... because it could get really fast and was a bit puzzle like.

[AMSDOS]

I actually think the Screen Flip in Gryzor isn't all that bad, sure the opener level does suggest that the landscape should scroll, though it doesn't and it doesn't really make the game any worse, if anything it might be better for not scrolling! Scrolling is a funny thing and can be done badly though it can look good too, certain games demand scrolling though in Gryzor the programmers have decided to move the man around the screen perhaps that was what the programmer wanted, a scrolling game for example might have compromised the speed of the game for instance, and while I've played some great scrolling games, sometimes I wonder that because a game scrolls it might have an impact on how the gamer plays, not necessarily bad, though if the people who wrote Gryzor considered if something of a hinderance on the game, then they might have chosen with the flick screen method.
In some games where there maybe a character and the game scrolls, your character is stuck in one position while their movement moves everything else around you for example. I would have thought they would have been the hardest since everything else around you is being moved. It perhaps the method to use in a simple shoot-em-up with a space ship position along one row and animations of made for a starscape to scroll around you perhaps to give your ship the sense of travel and a game like Xybots where your character seems to be stuck in one position and waddles - square to square at the end.

[fano]

About Gryzor and scrolling , this prototype shows us how a 128K version should be great !
http://www.cpc-power.com/index.php?page=detail&num=3556

If someone is interested , Face Hugger gave us the source : http://www.cpc-power.com/index.php?page=detail&onglet=notices&num=3556

[Xyphoe]

I actually think the Screen Flip in Gryzor isn't all that bad...................

It would have been better if they adopted a more push-scroll system which you can witness in Ghosts N Goblins - may have been the happy compromise/middle ground here.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tIlTIzvyiBc

[TFM]

In G&G they scroll whole Mode 1 chars, ignoring the Mode 2 scroll possibility.

Take a look at TTL (Tornado Low Level), the scrolling paradigm ;-)
(Is it missing on youtube?)

And btw: Scrolling in X with 2 Pixel-Offsets needs four OUT instead of two. It's really easy. Game developpers are really supposed to do it - IMHO.

[ukmarkh]

When you look at games like Savage, Dan Dare III and Astro Marine Corps... you quickly realise that Gryzor on the CPC could have easily used a scrolling engine, but despite how things turned out i still think Gryzor on the CPC is an instant classic.

[fano]

When you look at games like Savage, Dan Dare III and Astro Marine Corps... you quickly realise that Gryzor on the CPC could have easily used a scrolling engine, but despite how things turned out i still think Gryzor on the CPC is an instant classic.

Savage and AMC use a software scrolling.AMC parralax scrolling is great but really slow compared to the surface scrolled (32*16 chars) , it is sometimes unplayable 

And btw: Scrolling in X with 2 Pixel-Offsets needs four OUT instead of two. It's really easy. Game developpers are really supposed to do it

I suppose you are speaking about R3 scrolling, there is a polemic about as it is not garanted to be clean and to have the same behaviour on all monitors/TV.

[jbaudrand]

Bombjack 1 ; barbarian, target renegade, and and.. rescue on Fractalus: I'm french, never understood the english manual when I was kid, and trust me, when me & my bros first meet the alien punching the cockpit, we shout of terror so loud, that our mom hurry to our room to see what's going on earth!

[AMSDOS]

fano wrote:

About Gryzor and scrolling , this prototype shows us how a 128K version should be great !

Looks good, too bad they didn't do it like this in 1987 (there lies in the problem unfortunately!  ). When was Meltdown released?
I remember the riot AA had when the Addams Family was on the covertape, I think it was more to do with Forbidden Planet being the only other game. Should of just given what the people wanted - Elite!     

[AMSDOS]

Xyphoe wrote:

It would have been better if they adopted a more push-scroll system which you can witness in Ghosts N Goblins - may have been the happy compromise/middle ground here.

I prefer Wonderboy myself!   

[AMSDOS]

Twin World Scrolls nicely - has some of the best mode 1 graphics too! 

[TFM]

When you look at games like Savage, Dan Dare III and Astro Marine Corps... you quickly realise that Gryzor on the CPC could have easily used a scrolling engine, but despite how things turned out i still think Gryzor on the CPC is an instant classic.

Well, I really agree.

[Xifos]

You have forgotten Switchblade and Dark Fusion ! 
Dark Fusion is for me the best shooter on CPC, better than Turrican.
(i am talking about games before 1993, because now we have Dead on time and Star Sabre)
And...
Targhan
Chase HQ
Beyond the ice palace
Super Cauldron
Double Dragon 2
Emlyn Hughes International Soccer

But if i had to choose one, i would say : Target Renegade !
It plays as good as Final Fight series on Supernes or Streets of rage series on Megadrive !

[AMSDOS]

Dark Fusion is an interesting one, I'm just a but stumped as to how to play it!    Cause your little Rocketman seems to love the ground more than anything! 

[Xifos]

Dark Fusion is an interesting one, I'm just a but stumped as to how to play it!    Cause your little Rocketman seems to love the ground more than anything! 

Press the "S" key to use an item.
You have to collect two items (up arrow symbol) for higher jump.

[norecess]

It's weird you seem to define a good game thanks to the technic it makes use.


I always thought a game was all about the gameplay... 

[Xifos]

Don't know if it was for me but...

Bad technic will often give bad gameplay.
On the other hand you can have good programming, good music, good graphics and bad gameplay...

Look at Turrican CPC : i don't like the gameplay because it's too slow, response is not good and the screen is too small...
But i enjoyed playing Un Squadron or Emlyn, even if they are slow on CPC.
Of course it's a matter of personnal taste, and it depends on the type of game...

But you're right, a game should be judged mostly by it's gameplay.

[AMSDOS]

Xifos wrote:

Press the "S" key to use an item.
You have to collect two items (up arrow symbol) for higher jump.


Interesting - Dark Fusion is a very nice game, the graphics, scrolling, sound, playability all nicely done, though I found it quite difficult! Otherwise it's really good. I probably wasn't playing it properly to know the game better. I guess when it comes to games with excellent difficulty I think of games like Silkworm!    Otherwise it's difficult to get difficulty levels right as different people have different ideas as to what's difficult and what's not.