Download link : http://cpcwiki.eu/index.php/File:Phreaks.dsk
Hope you will like this prod. ;)
Quote from: norecess on 20:44, 16 December 10
Download link : http://cpcwiki.eu/index.php/File:Phreaks.dsk (http://cpcwiki.eu/index.php/File:Phreaks.dsk)
Hope you will like this prod. ;)
Pah!!! annoying me with this and that and..... and wanting me to write an advertising? ???
And you just find 8 words, 1 point, 1 double-point and a link?
:o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o :o
Well not with me! 8)
Here you go:
Condense released a new CPC demo today!
You surely know the "State Of The Art" demo...
And the guys from
Condense made it now for our beloved CPC!
[youtube=N7o4sDbSQmg]N7o4sDbSQmg[/youtube]
So don't miss it on your local CPC now!
You'll find it here:
Pouet-link (http://www.pouet.net/prod.php?which=56415)
Great Idea, great job. I like that time lapse moves :-)))
What a cool demo! :) What frame rate did you manage to get?
I loved "State of the Art" and because of this I also started to write a "version" (I used the iPod advert dancers instead) but found my compression routines sucked and didn't finish it :(
Reminds me to my small advert demo I made once for JavaCPC :D
[cpcsmall=http://cpcwiki.eu/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=1723.0;attach=1151,anim,1]CPC6128[/cpcsmall]
Press 1 or 2 to choose music :D
That's a nice one too!
Hey this is Kim Basinger from cool world movie (with a young brad pitt...)...
Better with girls...
The state of the art is good looking but perhaps... a... bit... slow...
Yet what would you expect on a CPC ???
Perhaps this would be faster without the masked sprites/tiles... ::)
Or what it it were on PLUS, the sprite then done with Hardwired sprites : no place in memory once loaded in the asic...perhaps less CPU to display them too... and extra colours...
BTW Phreaks looks very good and gets sweet antialiasing... and sweet music too.
Hi ! Great to see you enjoy the demo 8)
The slowness is a voluntary thing. MacDeath is right, if I remove the masked sprites, then I get a major performance boost (something like x2 to x3 in some circumstances). Unfortunately, CPC memory does not expand with better code optimizations (hehe) and I'm still have to deal with the same 195 frames. As a reference, 195 frames in 50hz = 4 seconds of demo (arg).
Also, the screen was appearing really "nude", there was something missing without those sprites..
The very technical thing here in this prod is the data generation ; having 20 frames = super easy, 50 frames = you need to get a well-structured data structure, 195 frames is... hardcore :)
Actually, Hicks created a custom version of Exomizer where we can change data-source "on the fly" while unpacking.. so that way the data gets directly unpacked while reading the stream.. why? because data packs much better in a large 64Kb buffer than many 2Kb buffers....
I also had to design the "perfect" data-structure, the one where I could get the best packing ratio once compressed with Exomizer. Trust me, I spent something like 2 months to get this result..
The rest running on CPC is relatively trivial and all of you here would be able to do the same for sure. ;)
Changing Exomizer for this is... :o Again, well done! Great Demo! And thanks for the story :) ;D
Is this 64K ram or 128K ram demo ?
Not having those sprite would save a little bit of bits (really a few... ok...)
Perhaps you should try something like a loop animation...such as it could loop again and again until...
Well easy to say... would look quite mechanical perhaps.
Can find some animooted.Gif...
A great demo.
I was thinking about the masked sprites too.
So do are you doing overdraw mostly here where the sprites are covering the image, or do you tag which tiles are completely covered with sprites and ignore those?
for the frame, yes, it's masked
not for the sprites, I could have gain some major space but in the end I would have gained something like 2 more frames..? there is always a limit of : does it worth it?
The first anim (moving head) is a loop animation.
Nice demo, nice compression. You have around 300 bytes a frame, but are working with very simple monochrome images. Are you storing the skip (in bytes) in pixels (half-pixels, for the anti-aliasing) between toggling on/off the monochrome image data?
Is there really antialiasing going on? You can't tell by the YT vid...
Yeah, there's horizontal anti-aliasing, probably just plotting a darker colour for the edge pixel if the lowest bit in the X co-ord (assuming monochrome run-length encoding at twice the horizontal resolution of MODE 0) is set.
PS: Should this thread be moved to the Demos forum?
Quote from: Briggsy on 01:45, 19 December 10
Nice demo, nice compression. You have around 300 bytes a frame, but are working with very simple monochrome images. Are you storing the skip (in bytes) in pixels (half-pixels, for the anti-aliasing) between toggling on/off the monochrome image data?
I just had another go at my dancers and got them down to 500 bytes per frame with no compression.
Gotta think of a way to squeeze some more out of it ;)
Yeah, it's nice start.
I used delta packing. Actually, the first image of sequence is the one taking lots of memory. The others should be way smaller than 150 bytes.. :P
Don't forget images are 192x205 pixels! :P
Perhaps someday I will expose my approach.. :P
The massive shitstorm at Push N' Pop was fun, though. :P
I love when the CPC world seems to collapse into civil war, there must be a lot of CPC in Ivory coast.
Perhaps with a silhouette of Sabrina Salermo (boyzboyzboyz) and sperm splashes as sprites would have please more people... :laugh:
Sorry for the trolling. :'(
BTW... for the shadow/shape/silhouette... how does it work ?Do you use "empty" tiles for the interrior and a set of tiles for the say shapes ?
exemple as posted...
Yeah, happy to be out from there.. ;D
Yes, the FX is tile-based, so it's a good guess from you!
I had to analyze all existing shapes along all bitmap sequences and build unique tiles for it.
Then basically give X,Y,TileIndex for each frames..
Then you have to take care which tile's width/height is the optimal one for a given sequence, cf. too big tiles will generate too many uniques indices, ...
After that, you have different approaches regarding the tiles, cf. use X/Y reversing to minimize tiles number, AND &FF etc,..
And on top of all of that, you have to organize your data to find the best compression ratio under Exomizer.. because A B C can be actually compressed better than A C B (by example)..
Let's tell it : I had much fun with this algorythm! :police:
Could it work with a smaller tiles system ?
I mean something like 4x4(mode1)... 1 quarter of a character..? or Half ... (dunnow...)
If your tiles are smaller, of course there are more to manage but you have a better "resolution" so you can cheat using less specific ones...
Err... maybe not..
Puting a carefull job into the conception of the "video" may ease too.
I mean you know, like choreography...
Hey it's like the IPod advertisement finally.
QuoteDon't forget images are 192x205 pixels!
Ok so it is a full horizontal display ? no wonder this is so heavy too...
Pro-tip : a pole dance !
the pole is a vertical bar...If the camera is static, this in one column that doesn't change... :D
Quote from: norecess on 03:59, 22 December 10
Yes, the FX is tile-based, so it's a good guess from you!
I was thinking about it this morning and I was thinking. What if tiles were used?
Now I read you already do that. Cool.
Quote from: norecess on 03:59, 22 December 10
Let's tell it : I had much fun with this algorythm! :police:
I believe.
Quote from: MacDeath on 01:39, 22 December 10
The massive shitstorm at Push N' Pop was fun, though. :P
Got a link to this?
Quote from: redbox on 11:38, 22 December 10
Got a link to this?
http://www.pushnpop.net/index.php?action=posts&id=186&category=0&page=1#lastpost
http://www.pushnpop.net/index.php?action=posts&id=188&category=0&page=1#lastpost
Quote from: arnoldemu on 12:05, 22 December 10
http://www.pushnpop.net/index.php?action=posts&id=186&category=0&page=1#lastpost (http://www.pushnpop.net/index.php?action=posts&id=186&category=0&page=1#lastpost)
http://www.pushnpop.net/index.php?action=posts&id=188&category=0&page=1#lastpost (http://www.pushnpop.net/index.php?action=posts&id=188&category=0&page=1#lastpost)
Classic flame war.
I agree with your sentiment - the best reply is to make a better demo (if you can!).
I'm very grateful people like NoRecess are programming demos, and even more so that he is willing to talk about it's production.
Concerning the reproach made against the Phreaks show (pun)...
-Music : it is not bad, I liked it actually.
-Graphics : well, the sprites are suposed to be dirty stains on the screen... they look disgusting : job done !
And, well... ok the framerate of the animation could have loved to be twice faster... but it's a start.
The stuff longs for 5 minutes...
So yeah...may certainly do better but...this is a first step, and it is definitly not bad at all.
Good margin remains to imrpouve the stuff.
The choreagraphy could be betterly Choosen to fit the music.
As I said, a new one could get a slow sexy music and a sexy girl show poledancing... ::)
But getting the stuff working with handicaps (sprites, bigger screen, and so on) allow to see the limitations betterly and then let the competition begins.
Is it a 128K Demo or a 64K demo ?
BTW the margin to get a "better" animation is good thx to all the self imposed handicaps.
Mode0... did you used the technic used in Ghoul's N Ghost/Ghost N Goblins ?
You know ? the "4 colours only for background and 3 colours only for sprites" ???
This could be used to get tiles containing twice the number of stuff...
On an Amstrad PLUS, mixed with Hardwired Sprites (to get more colours and element displayed...less boring stuff as you said about the masked sprites ) and the ease to rasterbar the top and bottom of the screen, this may ease the way into an improuved version.
Well, forget that thing on P'n'P : what is done is done. Still, it's a sad day for CPC demoscene.
the framerate of the animation could have loved to be twice faster... but it's a start.
I repeat myself, but slowing down the animation is a voluntar process. It could have been possible to x2 / x3 the speed anim but this would have required more memory for that .. of course, it's already pushing the 128Kb memory limit to the max !
Mode0... did you used the technic used in Ghoul's N Ghost/Ghost N Goblins ?
No. It can work in every modes.
I agree about the improved Plus version. But it would differ from Old version (speed) so it was not my target.
the best reply is to make a better demo (if you can!).
Sadly, no. I'm out of demoworld now on CPC.
Could it work with a smaller tiles system ?
My custom tools determined that 2x5 was the best size for tiles. But yes, smaller could work too, bigger too - as a reference, know that there are 112 unique different tiles used along all the animation.
Hey it's like the IPod advertisement finally.
Yes, really, it is : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hPYjUmpEqxo (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hPYjUmpEqxo)
Quote from: norecess on 15:23, 22 December 10
the best reply is to make a better demo (if you can!).
Sadly, no. I'm out of demoworld now on CPC.
That is sad, are you leaving the cpc completely, or are you considering making a game?
Too early to answer (about my future activities).
Leaving CPC ? Of course no ! :P
Quote from: norecess on 16:43, 22 December 10
Leaving CPC ? Of course no ! :P
Glad to hear it :)
Ignore the flame wars, there will always be someone (*cough*) who wants to criticise rather than support, but usually it's for their own reasons rather than anything to do with the 'scene'.
Looking forward to your next production, whatever it might be!
Check my website for algorithm implementation.