CPC 6128 PLUS - NO DRIVE - disc missing

[willow3411]

Hi all !
I'm back with a new problem...
So here is a cpc 6128 Plus.
everything works fine except the floppy disk.
when I run a CAT, the engine does not turn and I get the disc missing message (see photo).
my tests: change of floppy ---> same
change of power supply --> same.
I don't think the chips are hot.

the floppy disk drive LED inside lights up

I have 5v at the floppy level

Have you ever had this problem?
I can do tests with a multimeter and oscilloscope (you'll have to explain a little ).

I wonder ?
the floppy works on 12v right?
how is 12v managed since there is only 5v?

thanks in advance
willow

[willow3411]

my motherboard with floppy

best regards
willow

[eto]

I wonder ?
the floppy works on 12v right?
how is 12v managed since there is only 5v?

The Plus floppies need 5V only. 

[Audronic]

@willow3411 

Perhaps the Belt is Broken in the disk drive
Or
Try another disk

Good Luck

keep Safe

Ray

[willow3411]

@willow3411

Perhaps the Belt is Broken in the disk drive
Or
Try another disk

Good Luck

keep Safe

Ray

hello,

Thank you for answering me
so yes I forgot to specify:
the belt is new
I changed the floppy drive with my old CPC 6128 drive which works very well.
I specify that the engine does not run at all!

willow3411

[andycadley]

You can't just use the drive from a 6128 inside a Plus. The older models used 12V drives, but the Plus doesn't supply 12V. You need a 5V drive from a Plus machine.

[willow3411]

You can't just use the drive from a 6128 inside a Plus. The older models used 12V drives, but the Plus doesn't supply 12V. You need a 5V drive from a Plus machine.

Hi
Ah OK
so possible that it is my reader which is out of service?

so how to test?
apart from putting back a cpc reader plus?

best regards
willow

[willow3411]

I can possibly mount a gotek to test, right?
I cannot find the diagram of the cpc 6128 more concerning the operation of the floppy

[eto]

I can possibly mount a gotek to test, right?

yes. If I remember right, you have to jumper it to S0 if you use it internally. 

so how to test?

I guess you can try the Plus-drive in the CPC 6128. I would not connect the 12V though. Not sure if it's connected on the PCB but better play safe. 

I cannot find the diagram of the cpc 6128 more concerning the operation of the floppy

what diagram do you mean?

[willow3411]

what diagram do you mean?

the diagram of the cpc 6128 plus motherboard and possibly the floppy drive it is a 157v

I guess you can try the Plus-drive in the CPC 6128. I would not connect the 12V though. Not sure if it's connected on the PCB but better play safe. 

yes 
I hadn't thought about it

I can possibly mount a gotek to test, right?

ok thanks....

[eto]

the diagram of the cpc 6128 plus motherboard and possibly the floppy drive it is a 157v

I haven't seen floppy schematics but  Plus schematics are on the Wiki:
https://www.cpcwiki.eu/index.php/Schematics#CPC_Plus_Schematics

[SerErris]

The 12V line in the 6128 drives are used only for the motor. So if you have no 12V, the Motor has no power at all. That is why you have no motor spinning. 

And if the motor is not spinning, you have no index hole passing the sensor and therefore never a ready signal.

A gotek will work just fine, but you need to use a special data cable, as the pinout is noth 34 pin standard.

[willow3411]

The 12V line in the 6128 drives are used only for the motor. So if you have no 12V, the Motor has no power at all. That is why you have no motor spinning.
And if the motor is not spinning, you have no index hole passing the sensor and therefore never a ready signal.
A gotek will work just fine, but you need to use a special data cable, as the pinout is noth 34 pin standard.

OK thanks,
so if I understand correctly in the cpc 6128 plus the 5v is transformed into 12v for the floppy drive?
If so, what are the components that allow this?
IC109? (LA6393D)
Sincerely
willow3411

[d_kef]

The 12V line in the 6128 drives are used only for the motor. So if you have no 12V, the Motor has no power at all. That is why you have no motor spinning.
And if the motor is not spinning, you have no index hole passing the sensor and therefore never a ready signal.
A gotek will work just fine, but you need to use a special data cable, as the pinout is noth 34 pin standard.

OK thanks,
so if I understand correctly in the cpc 6128 plus the 5v is transformed into 12v for the floppy drive?
If so, what are the components that allow this?
IC109? (LA6393D)
Sincerely
willow3411

The 6128 Plus drive is 5 volt only. So no DC to DC conversion is needed.

d_kef

[SerErris]

The 12V line in the 6128 drives are used only for the motor. So if you have no 12V, the Motor has no power at all. That is why you have no motor spinning.
And if the motor is not spinning, you have no index hole passing the sensor and therefore never a ready signal.
A gotek will work just fine, but you need to use a special data cable, as the pinout is noth 34 pin standard.

OK thanks,
so if I understand correctly in the cpc 6128 plus the 5v is transformed into 12v for the floppy drive?
If so, what are the components that allow this?
IC109? (LA6393D)
Sincerely
willow3411

No that is wrong. The 6128 and 6128 Plus use different drives that are not compatible.

If you put a 6128 Plus drive in a 6128, you will potentially burn it (if the +12V pin is actually connected, which it should not if it is not used). 

If you put a 6128 drive into a 6128 Plus it will just not spin. The rest of the logic works.

As the 6128 does not obey the todays 3.5 inch drive power connector standards. It is actually reversed.

This is why you cannot plug the power connector from a 6128 into a Gotek, as it will fry it and any usb stick you plug into it. The 12V line is connected to the 5V input on the Gotek. In a Plus that is either not a problem, or you do not get my power at all. 

[willow3411]

No that is wrong. The 6128 and 6128 Plus use different drives that are not compatible.

If you put a 6128 Plus drive in a 6128, you will potentially burn it (if the +12V pin is actually connected, which it should not if it is not used). 

If you put a 6128 drive into a 6128 Plus it will just not spin. The rest of the logic works.

As the 6128 does not obey the todays 3.5 inch drive power connector standards. It is actually reversed.

This is why you cannot plug the power connector from a 6128 into a Gotek, as it will fry it and any usb stick you plug into it. The 12V line is connected to the 5V input on the Gotek. In a Plus that is either not a problem, or you do not get my power at all. 

so my problem comes from my cpc 6128 plus floppy drive.
how to know ?

[Audronic]

@willow3411

When you replaced the belt on the floppy drive did you unplug any connectors on the floppy drive motherboard ?
If so have they been re plugged ??

Keep Safe

Ray

[willow3411]

When you replaced the belt on the floppy drive did you unplug any connectors ?
If so have they been re plugged ??

Keep Safe

Good morning,

yes everything has been reconnected, I will check again just in case.

willow3411

[willow3411]

I took everything apart and reconnected it.
always nothing....
disc missing and no engine noise and nothing is running....
just the CAT diode a little lit (but weak).
Facade diode does not light up either.
snif snif

thanks

[SerErris]

Okay, you do have a 6128 Plus AND a 6128 Plus drive, correct? Just confirming as I am now a little bit confused.

[willow3411]

Okay, you do have a 6128 Plus AND a 6128 Plus drive, correct? Just confirming as I am now a little bit confused.

Hi
Yes that's fine.
I have a cpc 6128 plus AND a cpc 6128 plus floppy drive

willow3411

[Audronic]

@willow3411 

Ok last check.
Please check that the +5 Volt line at the 4 pin power connector on the drive is +5 Volts DC
also that the data lead (26 Pin cable) is correctly connected.
If it is then you could try this:- Unplug (The 26 Pin data lead) and put it in Upside down if that is possible.
The red light should now be LIT an the motor should be turning.
This is only to be used for testing

Good luck

Keep Safe

Ray

[willow3411]

Ok last check.
Please check that the +5 Volt line at the 4 pin power connector on the drive is +5 Volts DC
also that the data lead (26 Pin cable) is correctly connected.
If it is then you could try this:- Unplug (The 26 Pin data lead) and put it in Upside down if that is possible.
The red light should now be LIT an the motor should be turning.
This is only to be used for testing

Hi !
I do have 5v coming to the floppy connector.
I cannot reverse the 26p connector because there is a key on the connector.

Maybe I can power the 5v motor directly with my lab power supply?
in 5v obviously

best regards

willow3411

[SerErris]

You can give this a try. 

You may also check if you have any shorts on the drive (e.g. measure without anything connected GND to +5V). 

Also you may want to power the whole drive from your lab power supply and see how much Amps it draws. It should not be very high.

Can you please specifcy the drive exactly ? 

What you also can do is connect your working 6128 drive and power it from external power supply. And then see if it works. 

[Bryce]

What you also can do is connect your working 6128 drive and power it from external power supply. And then see if it works.

If you power the 6128 drive from a different supply as the CPC, you will need to connect the GND's of both supplies together or you could seriously damage either the drive or the CPC!

Bryce.