Author Topic: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)  (Read 3661 times)

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Offline Gryzor

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Elbox Computer is pleased to announce the new product for Amiga computers: TurboFlyer 530.

TurboFlyer 530 is a new 68030-based accelerator with integrated FastATA CF/SATA controller for Amiga 500/500+ and A2000 computers. TurboFlyer 530 it is an internal expansion, plugs into the 68000 processor socket.

Features:
• 68030 processor (with MMU) clocked at 40MHz
• 16MB of fast 32-bit DRAM memory on board

• Integrated FastATA CF/SATA controller:
-[/b] Fast transfer rate of up to 16.6MB/s
-[/b] Supports PIO-0, PIO-4 and PIO-5 modes
-[/b] Two buffered and terminated EIDE ports for four devices
-[/b] AllegroCDFS filesystem included
-[/b] LBA 48 support in the onboard BootROM (support of drives over 128GB)
-[/b] Automatically configured EIDE/CF/SATA/ATAPI devices
-[/b] Can boot from FAT16 and FAT32 formatted devices

• Includes custom expansion port for local hardware add-ons
• MapROM function (uses 1MB from 16MB of the on-board DRAM)
• Compatible with trapdoor Slow memory expansions (up to 1.8 MB)
• Compatible with Chip memory expansions
• Compatible with WHDLoad software

Pricing and availability:
TurboFlyer 530 will be on sale in February 2014 at the suggested retail price of 240 EUR (VAT excl.).[/font]


http://elbox.com/news_13_12_06.html

Offline gerald

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Re: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)
« Reply #1 on: 21:20, 14 December 13 »
• Integrated FastATA CF/SATA controller:
SATA controller but only 16MB of RAM  :o
Just curious of the form factor. If the SATA compatibility is achieved like on the FastATA 4000 MK-VI CF/SATA (http://eu-shop.elbox.com/en_US/p/FastATA-4000-MK-VI-CFSATA/14), no chance of integrating this in a 500

Waiting for it !

« Last Edit: 21:29, 14 December 13 by gerald »

Offline TFM

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Re: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)
« Reply #2 on: 00:03, 15 December 13 »
To me it sounds like you buy a new computer and use the amiga itself as keyboard only. Like the super cpu for c64.


I don't like that kinds of cards, because they smell like "fake": Look what my c64 / amiga can do! (Yes, of course, just add a new cpu  :-\ ).
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Offline Gryzor

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Re: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)
« Reply #3 on: 10:46, 15 December 13 »
The Amiga has a long history of CPU upgrades, so the only thing new this here adds is the SATA/etc expansion. Still quite a traditional way to supercharge a poor A500. But *of course* you wouldn't like it.

Offline gerald

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Re: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)
« Reply #4 on: 12:31, 15 December 13 »
Yes, the only new thing is the SATA, but when you look at how its done, it's not different from a SCSI to IDE or   IDE to CF.

Back in 1992, GVP already proposed a 68030/40MHz + 8MB RAM for the 500 + SCSI +HD. This made the 500 to the A3000 level. Some other manufacturers already proposed 68030+8MB ram back in 1990, but without mass storage.

To me it sounds like you buy a new computer and use the amiga itself as keyboard only. Like the super cpu for c64.

Most Amiga where designed to be CPU expandable (1200, 3000, 4000 internally, 500 with the side port)

I don't like that kinds of cards, because they smell like "fake": Look what my c64 / amiga can do! (Yes, of course, just add a new cpu  :-\ ).
Like 4MB RAM extension, mass storage that is not MFM formated, or mouse that does requires an external microcontroller to communicate with the CPC  ;)

For me what define an Amiga is its custom chip, a 680xx, and its OS.

Offline Gryzor

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Re: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)
« Reply #5 on: 12:34, 15 December 13 »
Quote from: gerald
Yes, the only new thing is the SATA, but when you look at how its done, it's not different from a SCSI to IDE or   IDE to CF.


Yup, you're right. Since Amiga had HDD support from early on, this is nothing new either. Maybe the CF, but a HDD? not really, except for the support for newer standards.

Offline TFM

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Re: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)
« Reply #6 on: 04:10, 16 December 13 »
You can't seriously compare a RAM expansion with a new CPU. That's like to compare medicine against a flu with heart replacement surgery.   :P
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Offline Gryzor

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Re: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)
« Reply #7 on: 09:21, 16 December 13 »
Erm... a 4MB expansion for the CPC is far more out there than a CPU replacement on the Amiga. As Gerald said, and as you can see in any magazine of the era, CPU upgrades were the bread and butter of expansion manufacturers for the Amiga back then. Nothing new here.

Offline arnoldemu

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Re: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)
« Reply #8 on: 11:43, 16 December 13 »
68030?

there were 68060 Amiga accelerators back in the day.
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Offline Gryzor

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Re: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)
« Reply #9 on: 11:47, 16 December 13 »
Precisely... A few weeks back I was reading several Amiga magazines, and literally every second advert involved a CPU upgrade.

Offline ralferoo

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Re: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)
« Reply #10 on: 14:46, 16 December 13 »
I agree. I actually bought an 68030 board clocked at 40MHz for my A1200 in 1994.

Ultimately, I sent it back because they kept advertising it as featuring an MMU and each time they sent it back with an EC chip that didn't have an MMU. Presumably most people wouldn't have know the difference but I wanted to use enforcer and try out unix on it.

But every Amiga ever has had expansion slots for memory and as others have said, CPU upgrades were part of the Amiga tradition for a while. In fact, the A1200 trapdoor was designed so an expansion card could disable the internal CPU - up until then, CPU upgrades always required you to unplug the 68000 and plug the board into that.

Also, as others have said, the custom chips are what make the Amiga special. An A1200 with a good accelerator card was no different to an A4000, except for form factor and lack of further expansion options. So, no, this is still very much an Amiga at the end of the day.

What is a shame though, is because the Amiga is so frequently upgraded, unexpanded Amigas and STs get lumped into Oldschool demos along with all the 8-bits at most demoparties, and the Amiga/ST categories only run on machines with accelerator cards which are hard to get nowadays. Perhaps this new card will change that.

Offline TFM

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Re: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)
« Reply #11 on: 17:09, 16 December 13 »
Erm... a 4MB expansion for the CPC is far more out there than a CPU replacement on the Amiga. As Gerald said, and as you can see in any magazine of the era, CPU upgrades were the bread and butter of expansion manufacturers for the Amiga back then. Nothing new here.


You are comparing apples and peas. Stay with one system. A bit RAM more makes no difference in architecture. But the replace the brain or heart of a system - means adding new opcodes - it a very profound alteration of the system. Tradition or not.

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Offline Gryzor

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Re: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)
« Reply #12 on: 18:34, 16 December 13 »
Not really, no. You're talking about technicalities. Whereas, a 4MB expansion for the CPC is far more exotic for the platform than a major CPU upgrade for the Amiga, which had this (CPU upgrading) etched into its DNA.


But, of course, and like always, you have to take the contrarian view, take over the thread and lead it to whatever it is you're thinking. Like always.

PS as a side-note, and remarkably so, the Amiga is still alive and kicking even after many hardware iterations. And I'm not even an Amiga fan.

Offline TFM

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Re: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)
« Reply #13 on: 19:20, 16 December 13 »
RAM = CPU
CPC = AMIGA
APPLE = PEA


 :laugh:
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Offline gerald

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Re: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)
« Reply #14 on: 20:42, 16 December 13 »
You are comparing apples and peas. Stay with one system. A bit RAM more makes no difference in architecture. But the replace the brain or heart of a system - means adding new opcodes - it a very profound alteration of the system. Tradition or not.
Having a 68010 instead of a 68000, my amiga suffered a profound alteration of the system. Luckily, 99.9% of the SW did not take offence and most of them took advantage of it. And I am pretty confident they will accommodate a 68030 as well.
The Amiga have been design with CPU upgrade capability (from A2000), that's a fact, not a tradition.

Now 8 times more RAM than the system has been designed to support (4M = 8x512k) is a difference in architecture.
Can you name any SW supporting 4MB RAM on CPC? By supporting, I mean that they where designed to support 4MB of RAM even so these extension did not exist at design time.
Finding ones that use more than 128k is already a challenge.

Offline TFM

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Re: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)
« Reply #15 on: 21:10, 16 December 13 »
Why do you ask me? I didn't choose the example.  8) :P




BTW... How can a RAM expansion be a difference in system architecture, while the replace of the CPU is not? That's ridiculous.  :laugh:




Like too often a thread get's hijacked to a discussion about "I'm right, and you are not", instead of discussing the advantages or dangers of such a profound thing as CPU exchange.  >:(
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Offline ralferoo

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Re: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)
« Reply #16 on: 21:37, 16 December 13 »
BTW... How can a RAM expansion be a difference in system architecture, while the replace of the CPU is not? That's ridiculous.  :laugh:
The CPC was sold as standard with 64KB and 128KB RAM, 4MHz CPU only. A faster CPU is radically different for the CPC. More than 128KB is unusual, the dk'Tronics 576KB is rare, a 4MB expansion is almost unheard of.

The Amiga was sold as standard with anything from an 8MHz 68000 to a 40MHz 68040, in fact maybe faster, I don't know. Likewise, as standard they came with anything from 256KB for the VERY early model, 512KB on the basic model through to 2MB chip RAM and 2MB fast RAM as standard on the high end models and the bigger boxes were designed to be expanded to up to 8MB. Everything was designed to handle massive variations in both CPU and RAM, because there was always such a variety. Sure, 90% of people has the same configuration (back in the day, A500 with extra 512KB RAM, later an A1200 expanded to 2MB RAM), but there was no excuse not to be able to write code that'd work on everyone's machine because actually, the CPUs were very compatible.

And like I (and pretty much everyone else) has said before, this expansion tranforms the most basic Amiga up to the level of the most recent Amigas. It's still fundamentally an Amiga and would run pretty much all software written and the vast majority of software would automatically take advantage of the extra features. And again, the custom chips are what makes the Amiga and Amiga. And even they went through massive changes through the lifetime of the Amiga, far more significant than this upgrade.
« Last Edit: 21:40, 16 December 13 by ralferoo »

Offline TFM

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Re: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)
« Reply #17 on: 23:37, 16 December 13 »
The CPC was sold as standard with 64KB and 128KB RAM, 4MHz CPU only. A faster CPU is radically different for the CPC. ...


Agreed!  :)
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Offline Gryzor

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Re: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)
« Reply #18 on: 23:47, 16 December 13 »
Quote from: TFM
BTW... How can a RAM expansion be a difference in system architecture, while the replace of the CPU is not? That's ridiculous.

Not ridiculous at all. Swapping the CPU was part of the Amiga architecture, really this is not so hard to understand...

Offline MacDeath

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Re: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)
« Reply #19 on: 09:03, 17 December 13 »
If i remember there is a DIY page on the wiki with the dreadfull 6mhz Z80 overclock of death...


6 MHz CPC - CPCWiki


Still a bit strange the way the Video circuit is also faster.
Can the compnent simply be replaced by faster models ?


Like, you replace the Z80A by a Z80B or C or D... overclock the gateArray+CRTC, get faster RAMs perhaps... and get a Z80 based Atari ST...lol.
Have someone tried to overclock the ASIC for the PLUS ?


And I suppose any modern hardware emulator (card recreating the CPC, clones if you prefer) should be able to overclock, be it for the video or the CPU or even sound...
also they should be able to do both CPC/PLUS and PCW.

Offline TFM

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Re: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)
« Reply #20 on: 22:06, 02 January 14 »
Can you name any SW supporting 4MB RAM on CPC? By supporting, I mean that they where designed to support 4MB of RAM even so these extension did not exist at design time.


Sure...


Category:4 MB RAM Software - CPCWiki
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Offline Gryzor

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Re: A new accelerator (and more...) board for the Amiga :)
« Reply #21 on: 00:25, 03 January 14 »

Sure...


Category:4 MB RAM Software - CPCWiki


Yeah, which -as discussed before- is a non-list :D